Examination of Witnesses (Questions 420
- 439)
TUESDAY 4 JULY 2006
MR KETAN
KOTECHA
Q420 Joan Ruddock:
You never referred, you never took advice?
Mr Kotecha: No.
Q421 Joan Ruddock:
And they never contacted you at any time?
Mr Kotecha: No.
Q422 Joan Ruddock:
I think you will understand that it is our view that the practices
you were engaged in were ones which were in breach of the OECD
Guidelines, Guidelines of which you say you are unaware. Are you
now aware of those Guidelines?
Mr Kotecha: Frankly, no.
Q423 Joan Ruddock:
Even having been listed and having gone through that process of
discussion, you have felt no sense that you ought to know what
the OECD Guidelines are?
Mr Kotecha: We asked this question
of the UN Panel and they told us "You are in the resolved
case, so what you are doing, or what we have seen that you are
doing, it is okay," so we were not told "Don't do this;
do this; don't do it like that;" there was no approach at
all from the UN Panel.
Q424 Joan Ruddock:
There was no advice; the UN said "We listed you, but clearly
we got it wrong;" is that what you are saying?
Mr Kotecha: Correct. They had
not got it wrong but "Your case has been resolved."
Q425 Joan Ruddock:
What does "resolved" mean to you?
Mr Kotecha: Resolved means, to
me, that we were placed in there not correctly in the first place,
so after further explanation we had to give they understood our
explanation and they said it was fine. That is what I understand.
Q426 Joan Ruddock:
Have you changed any of your practices since this period?
Mr Kotecha: No; we do business
in the same way.
Q427 Joan Ruddock:
In the same way; everything is just the same?
Mr Kotecha: Yes.
Q428 John Barrett:
Clearly, you say your own company is reputable; there are serious
concerns that you have been dealing with some very disreputable
people. Have you stopped trading with anybody over a long period
of time because of any concerns that have been raised with those
companies you have been dealing with?
Mr Kotecha: No.
Q429 John Barrett:
Do you not find that it is hard to accept that you have been unaware
of any malpractices by anybody in the DRC over this prolonged
period of time, and it does look as if you have been prepared
to turn the other way or close your eyes to behaviour that has
gone on that certainly appears to be unacceptable?
Mr Kotecha: I do not know whether
that is a matter of opinion, because we have had no guidelines.
As a matter of fact, even now, we are open to any guidelines which
say that, "Fine, you are supposed to trade within these guidelines,
this is what you're supposed to do, what you're not supposed to
do."
Q430 John Barrett:
Have your own suspicions never been raised over a long period
of time, when a lot of very questionable acts have been going
on and lives have been lost, people have been killed, that you
have never once thought are any of the people you are dealing
with people you ought not to be dealing with? Has that never struck
you at all?
Mr Kotecha: No; because we ourselves
have also been at the losing end of what has happened there during
these wars that have gone on. Our family has also lost a lot of
investments and a lot of money there, so we are also part of it,
but we cannot just pick up our bag and, okay, off we go; our roots
are there, we have been there for a very, very long time. But
we are open to any guidelines, any suggestions, that "You're
supposed to do this; not do this," that is fine. We are open
to any guidance; please give us the guidance.
Q431 Richard Burden:
When you were informed by the Panel that your case was resolved,
how did they pass that information to you; did they tell you verbally,
did they send you a letter?
Mr Kotecha: Yes, they sent us
a letter.
Q432 Richard Burden:
Would you be prepared to share that letter with the Committee?
Mr Kotecha: Yes.
Q433 John Battle:
I have to say, I really appreciate the frank way you have answered
our questions but I am a little bit surprised that you do not
know about the OECD Guidelines. I just wonder, have you compared
notes with any other companies dealing in the same business, in
the same area, any of the others that were called in by the UN,
you have not asked yourself "Why were they caught and not
us"? When you were put on the list, my natural reaction,
if I were put on a list, would be to check out why I was on it
and somebody else was not. I would be looking at the others to
say, "It's them; not me." Why did you not do that?
Mr Kotecha: As I said, it started
with the illegal exportation; we did not want to do anything illegal.
My point was to prove that we did not do anything illegal and
we are not here just during the conflict, we have been here 20
years before the conflict.
Q434 John Battle:
There is a lot of talk now about Corporate Social Responsibility.
I come to this angle because in my neighbourhood a company polluted
not only the people who worked for them but the whole neighbourhood
with asbestos. They closed the factory down because there were
guidelines in Britain then, the 1936 Health and Safety Act. They
shut in 1958 and reopened in Bombay, knowing there were no guidelines
there, but they knew what they were doing and they knew about
guidelines in Britain. I just wonder, under the new headings,
of Corporate Social Responsibility, companies are aware of environmental
concerns, does human rights feature in your company's analysis
of where you invest, at all?
Mr Kotecha: Yes, it does, and,
for that matter, even the Kinshasa Government is now backing eastern
DRC, which you all must be aware of. If we had been doing something
that was totally wrong they would have approached us also. The
eastern had been abandoned for a good 10 years, whatever reasons
there were, Kinshasa was not ready, to an extent, to know what
was going on there, and we could not just pack our bags and say,
"Fine, down goes 30 years of our parents' lives and we just
pack up and go;" no. We do give back to society, we do have
certain programmes there that are happening, there is the vaccination,
there is education, these things are happening there, and I wish
that whoever wants to study these things in depth possibly will
look at it more in depth than just scratching the surface.
John Battle: Very fair. Thank you.
Q435 Chairman:
Some members of the Committee have been to Bukavu, in the last
few weeks, which I think is where your company operates. Just
for the record, can you tell me, first of all, how many people
the company employs directly, altogether, the whole company?
Mr Kotecha: Maybe 160, 170.
Q436 Chairman:
How many of those are based in the DRC?
Mr Kotecha: Most of them.
Q437 Chairman:
Most of your business really is in eastern Congo?
Mr Kotecha: The selling, and all
that, is done in DRC.
Q438 Chairman:
The turnover is derived mostly from the DRC?
Mr Kotecha: Correct.
Q439 Chairman:
Are you still paying taxes to RCD-Goma?
Mr Kotecha: No. The central government
has now taken over Bukavu, but normally, after the elections,
that is when things will get much more clear.
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