Examination of Witnesses (Questions 220-227)
MR JOHN
EAGLES, CAPTAIN
MERVYN GRANSHAW
AND MR
DAVID LUXTON
11 JANUARY 2006
Q220 Chairman: They are not always
persuaded of course of the improvement in their condition given
the extra numbers of flights but I accept what you say.
Captain Granshaw: And we do not
resist it. The industry does not resist the continuing environmental
improvements, but at the end of the day it is not the industry
that drives itself; the consumer drives the industry and the consumer
wants to travel.
Q221 Chairman: They are usually the
ones who go home having got off a plane to write a letter of complaint.
Do you think the CAA offers a 24-hour service on a sufficient
basis right the way across all of its responsibilities or do you
think that too much of it is done on a nine to five basis?
Mr Eagles: No, on the contrary,
I have known Civil Aviation Authority surveyors who have stayed
long after hours to finish an aeroplane for me. So certainly the
engineering staff are very dedicated to their jobs.
Q222 Chairman: You did say at one
point that there was a not very efficient electronic answering
service which means contacting the personnel licensing departments
could be very difficult indeed. Was that particularly what you
were thinking of?
Mr Eagles: Yes it was really.
Just try it, it is very hard, you just go round and round and
round.
Q223 Chairman: That unfortunately
does not make it unique.
Mr Eagles: No.
Q224 Chairman: Finally, do you think
the CAA is sufficiently accountable to the people it regulates,
what Sir Roy called the regulatees?
Captain Granshaw: Do we think
it is sufficiently?
Q225 Chairman: Accountable?
Captain Granshaw: My colleagues
and I have an issue in the sense that if we were doctors we would
regulate our own profession and here we are as safety professionals
and we do not regulate our own profession. Sometimes one feels
that one attends as a guest, as an observer but not as an equal
stakeholder.
Q226 Chairman: How could that be
affected by this so-called called light touch"?
Captain Granshaw: I do not think
the light touch is right for aviation. I think that there is a
difference between regulating a biscuit factory and regulating
something where safety is in the core of everything you do. I
question seriously whether lighter regulation is better for aviation.
I think from time to time you need to have a random check, not
just one because you have heard something, and really the underpinning
suggestions of lighter regulation do leave me wondering whether
we are doing the right thing here. When I heard the CAA say they
were doing it because it was probably the only way given their
resources and staff they could achieve it, it did strike me that
it was not their primary, preferred method of regulation, just
how they have to do it. It is all spread a little too thin.
Mr Luxton: I would certainly endorse
that.
Q227 Chairman: Do you think that
it would help if the recommendations of the Hampton Report were
carried into existence on risk assessment and on concentrating
resources in the areas where they are most needed?
Captain Granshaw: We do not like
risk in aviation so the idea of assessing the risk and working
that way round is completely wrong for aviation.
Chairman: You have all been very helpful,
gentlemen, and we are enormously grateful to you not only for
your written evidence but for what you have said today.
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