Examination of Witnesses (Questions 11780
- 11799)
11780. The position at Paddington is that you
have sought to link into the other underground tube lines. Correct?
(Mr Berryman) We have sought to link into all
the tube lines: the Hammersmith and City, the District, the Circle
and the Bakerloo Line.
11781. The philosophy was, in 1994 (whatever
you say about it, now, and I understand your points), that there
should be a link, and a subterranean link initially.
(Mr Berryman) There was an intention to use
the parcels tunnel to form a partial link I do not think anybody
could have claimed it was a very satisfactory link, because it
would have involved going underground and then a changed level
from basement level to, effectively, first-floor level—footbridge
level—here, and then across and down again.
11782. Yes, but there was a commitment to form
an underground link, of whatever sort.
(Mr Berryman) A partial underground link, yes.
11783. What is the formal commitment to any
link of any sort at the moment?
(Mr Berryman) I have explained how passengers
would make the movement from the Crossrail Station to the Hammersmith
and City Line station.
11784. All it is, is it not, is a facility by
which you get the passenger to Paddington railway station platform
and there he goes.
(Mr Berryman) Yes, that is correct.
11785. That is it; that is all you are doing.
(Mr Berryman) Yes, that is correct, but we
would say—and I do say—that there is a satisfactory
route already existing from there to the Hammersmith and City
Line, which is already fitted with MIP access, as we demonstrated
yesterday. One of the Members actually used it yesterday.
11786. Was it satisfactory in 1994?
(Mr Berryman) I was not the promoter in 1994.
11787. Was it satisfactory in 1994? The bridge
was there, was it not? Platform one was there.
(Mr Berryman) I am unable to answer questions
about the 1994 scheme; I was not involved in it at all.
11788. I am asking you now for your advice.
Was it satisfactory in 1994?
(Mr Berryman) Are you asking for my opinion
as an engineer?
11789. Mr Liddell-Grainger: Mr Clarkson
and Mr Berryman, this is a long time ago. Is it relevant?
11790. Mr Clarkson: Yes, it is relevant
because, whatever the picture was in 1994, the Promoters did not
feel it was appropriate to leave the passengers on platform one
to sort themselves out across the bridge; they took a different
course. That is why I ask the question, sir. I am not going into
detail, I just want to know how things have changed.
(Mr Berryman) As I have already said, I was
not involved in the scheme at all in 1994. I certainly do not
now and would not then have thought the arrangements proposed
here were in any way satisfactory.
11791. Let us remind ourselves of the document
that the Committee were given yesterday, which we need not turn
up—the route tour of Paddington.[27]
I will read it out because I have no doubt you do not have it
to hand. There is a paragraph under "Paddington Station"
(it is not paginated) after the photographs. "Interchange
with the District and Circle Line will be provided from the eastern
end of the Crossrail Station by a short passage at basement level.
This passage will provide level access to the northbound District
and Circle Line with access to the southbound District and Circle
Lines from the new footbridge and lifts. Provision will be made
to enable future interchange with the Hammersmith and City Line
to be provided from the Crossrail western ticket hall." Just
show us, would you, where the Crossrail Western ticket hall is
on one of the plans that we have put up this afternoon, just so
we can identify it? You will remember that "Provision will
be made to enable future interchange with the Hammersmith and
City Line to be provided from the Crossrail western ticket hall".
If we can just turn that up and, with your pointer, if you could
identify where it is you have in mind.[28]
(Mr Berryman) The Crossrail western
ticket hall is below ground in this area just here.
11792. And the Crossrail eastern ticket hall?
(Mr Berryman) Is here.
11793. So where is the provision to be made
to enable future interchange? What is it you have in mind?
(Mr Berryman) I am afraid that was copied from
an old document which was part of an earlier consultation round.
11794. So what the Committee was told yesterday
was wrong. Is that right?
(Mr Berryman) We did not particular raise that
with the Committee yesterday.
11795. It is yesterday's document, Mr Berryman.
(Mr Berryman) It was in the document. Yes,
I am afraid it was wrong.
11796. The careful evidence now, 24 hours later,
is that there will not be a provision to enable future interchange,
so we must—
(Mr Berryman) This ought to be a lesson to
me to read every single document that goes out and not just the
one which appears to be important at the time. Certainly, that
was a very old copy from a very old information sheet.
11797. It does concern us, you see, because
have Westminster or anybody else been given the details of the
engineering material you spoke of about the subterranean link?
Let us turn it up. It is 17.[29]
What I am talking about is that red link to the top left of the
plan, and you have given us some engineering comments about it.
Have those comments and the workings relevant to them been disclosed
or discussed with Westminster?
(Mr Berryman) No, they have not
because we are not proposing to do it, so you only need to discuss
things, surely, which form part of our proposals. For a variety
of reasons, as I have explained, this does not form part of our
proposal.
11798. It may not form part of the proposal
but you appreciate it forms part of Westminster's concern, do
you?
(Mr Berryman) Of course I do; they have just
said it does.
11799. And you appreciate that they want to
understand what it is you say about that. Do you appreciate that?
(Mr Berryman) Yes. As I said a moment ago,
this is not part of our proposal.
27 Crossrail Ref: P99,Paddington Station-Route Tour
Information for Paddington (SCN-20060621-002). Back
28
Crossrail Ref: P99, Paddington Station-Ticket Hall Level, 1994
Bill Proposal (WESTCC-32104A-012). Back
29
Crossrail Ref: P99, Paddington Station-Hammersmith & City
Line Interchange, Ticket Hall Plan, Option B-Low Level Subway
(WESTCC-32104A-017). Back
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