Examination of Witnesses (Questions 295-299)
RT HON
DES BROWNE
MP, LIEUTENANT GENERAL
NICK HOUGHTON
CBE, MR DESMOND
BOWEN CMG, MR
PETER HOLLAND
AND MS
LINDY CAMERON
OBE
8 MAY 2007
Q295 Chairman: Good afternoon, Secretary
of State, and welcome. As you know, this is a part of our second
inquiry into Afghanistan and we are taking evidence from you,
Secretary of State, for the second time in this second inquiry,
so you have been back and back, and we are most grateful to you
for doing this. We went to Afghanistan two or three weeks ago
and many of our questions will be informed by that visit, but
I wonder if I could ask you to begin, Secretary of State, by introducing
your team please.
Des Browne: Certainly, Chairman.
I am not that long back from Afghanistan myself, so perhaps we
can compare notes. On my far right is Desmond Bowen, who is the
Policy Director from the Ministry. Immediately to my right is
Lindy Cameron who is the Head of DFID Afghanistan and is part
of the team at the special request of the Committee. On my immediate
left is Lieutenant General Nick Houghton, who is here for the
second time in this inquiry as the Chief of Joint Operations and
for a second appearance also is Peter Holland, who is the—
Q296 Chairman: I think it is about
his third or fourth time.
Des Browne: In this current investigation?
Q297 Chairman: Not in this current
investigation, no.
Des Browne: Here in this current
investigation for the second time, and Peter Holland is also here
at the specific request of the Committee.
Q298 Chairman: We met Lindy Cameron
in Kabul. This is a personal comment of mine. I went to Afghanistan
this most recent time feeling really very pessimistic about it
and came back feeling less pessimistic, but thinking that the
work that is being done in Afghanistan is going to take a very
long time indeed. When we were there, we heard about progress
that had been made there and there was no doubt there was a lot
still to be done, but, Secretary of State, I wonder if you agree
that it should be suggested to the British people that this is
going to take a very long time indeed and certainly will take
the deployment of equipment and people way beyond 2009?
Des Browne: Well, can I just say
first of all, Chair, that I am pleased that your visit to Afghanistan
dispelled at least some of the pessimism, if not all of it, and
no doubt the rest of the questions that we face during this session
will be an indication as to what extent that was in dispelling
pessimism. It is of course a very significant challenge, what
we and others have taken on in Afghanistan, and I have never made
light of that at any time. Can I just say that I think people
ought to be reminded, and maybe the public should be reminded,
that in January of 2006, which would then be five years after
we had embarked on this challenge, at the London Conference the
international community in the Afghan Compact agreed with the
Government of Afghanistan that they would commit to five years
at that time, so that of itself takes the international community's
commitment, expressed in the Compact, to 2011. We ourselves as
a government made a bilateral commitment to Afghanistan for 10
years to support and be with them. I realise that that does not
mean that at that stage either the international community or
we ourselves committed to a military presence in Afghanistan for
either of those two periods and I think it is more the military
side of this that the Committee is interested in, although I believe
that this country, having been 30 years in conflict or more, will
take efforts to get to the stage where they will be able to stand
on their own two feet, and I think that the international community
will have to support them for a considerable period of time. Perhaps
some of the confusion in relation to time arises from the fact
that when we announced the deployment of troops into the southern
part of Afghanistan, we announced at the same time that, for planning
purposes, we would be planning to 2009, and that has been interpreted
as a commitment to 2009 with nothing beyond. My own view is that,
given the nature of the challenges there, particularly the security
challenge, we will have to stay with the Afghans beyond 2009,
but exactly how long and in what way I think it is too early to
tell. We have only been about one year deployed, I think it is
about a year almost exactly since we first deployed troops into
Helmand Province and I think it is just too early to say at this
stage exactly what the nature and shape of our commitment will
be beyond 2009, but I agree that we will have to have a commitment.
Exactly how many troops we will have to have there and what they
will be doing will be more a function of our ability to be able
to grow and develop the Afghan National Army and a police force
to provide security there than anything else.
Q299 Chairman: But about one month
ago you said that we were one of the few countries that could
actually do this really difficult work, so a lot of the burden
will fall to us in military terms. Do you think that, without
an increase in funding and in manning in Afghanistan, we will
be able to sustain the commitment that you are talking about now?
Des Browne: Well, I do not retract
any of the words that I used before, but I would need to look
at exactly the context of them to see what exactly I was talking
about as far as difficult work is concerned.
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