The
Committee consisted of the following
Members:
Chairman:
Mr.
David Wilshire
Bailey,
Mr. Adrian
(West Bromwich, West)
(Lab/Co-op)
Cable,
Dr. Vincent
(Twickenham)
(LD)
Clarke,
Mr. Charles
(Norwich, South)
(Lab)
Coffey,
Ann
(Stockport)
(Lab)
Dorrell,
Mr. Stephen
(Charnwood)
(Con)
Eagle,
Angela
(Exchequer Secretary to the
Treasury)
Greening,
Justine
(Putney)
(Con)
Iddon,
Dr. Brian
(Bolton, South-East)
(Lab)
Keeley,
Barbara
(Worsley)
(Lab)
Malins,
Mr. Humfrey
(Woking)
(Con)
Michael,
Alun
(Cardiff, South and Penarth)
(Lab/Co-op)
Newmark,
Mr. Brooks
(Braintree)
(Con)
Pugh,
Dr. John
(Southport)
(LD)
Raynsford,
Mr. Nick
(Greenwich and Woolwich)
(Lab)
Redwood,
Mr. John
(Wokingham)
(Con)
Southworth,
Helen
(Warrington, South)
(Lab)
Edward Waller, Committee
Clerk
attended the
Committee
Third
Delegated Legislation
Committee
Monday 27
October
2008
[Mr.
David Wilshire in the
Chair]
Draft Landfill Tax (Material from Contaminated Land) (Phasing out of Exemption) Order 2008
4.30
pm
The
Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Angela Eagle): I beg
to move,
That the
Committee has considered the draft Landfill Tax (Material from
Contaminated Land) (Phasing out of Exemption) Order 2008.
I welcome you
to the Chair, Mr. Wilshire. This is the first statutory
instrument that I have introduced under your chairmanship, but I am
sure that it will be the first of
many.
At
the moment, the Finance Act 1996 provides for exemption from landfill
tax of waste from the clean-up of contaminated land. Anyone who wishes
to make use of the exemption, such as a developer, must apply in
writing to Her Majestys Revenue and Customs. HMRC will then
consider the application with a view to issuing an exemption
certificate.
The order
will preclude the issue of exemption certificates if applications are
not submitted to HMRC before 1 December 2008, the cut-off
date for applications for certificates being 30 November 2008. That
approach to the cut-off date strikes a balance between drawing a line
under the ability to apply for an exemption certificate and allowing
reasonable flexibility, so that applications reaching HMRC before 1
December 2008 will still be considered valid even if they are not
accompanied by all the information that HMRC needs to issue a
certificate.
Mr.
John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con): Does the Minister think
the timing of the measure is felicitous as we are going into recession?
Will the extra cost not be damaging to
businesses?
Angela
Eagle: The overall implication of the changes should be
seen as a package with our proposals to extend land remediation relief,
which is a corporation tax relief, to cover expenditure on derelict
land and land contaminated by Japanese knotweed. Our approach, on which
we have consulted at length, is to achieve fiscal neutrality, so I do
not accept the right hon. Gentlemans implication that the
measure will cost money. It is a redistribution approach, which we aim
to make fiscally
neutral.
We
believe that the time is right to phase out the exemption. The order
will achieve the phase-out in a way that ensures that
the exemption comes to an end within a defined period. At the same
time, those who have worked up projects for land in expectation
of being able to benefit from the exemption will have a
reasonable opportunity to do so. Our plans for
land remediation relief, which is the other side of the equation, will
be introduced to the House in next years Finance
Bill.
With
that brief introduction, I am happy to listen to the debate, and to
answer any questions about our proposals, but I ask hon. Members to
bear in mind that this is only one aspect of a joint
package.
4.33
pm
Justine
Greening (Putney) (Con): It is a pleasure to serve under
your chairmanship, Mr.
Wilshire.
Whenever
we consider statutory instruments about the environment, at least two
questions need to be asked. One concerns the proposed impact on the
environment, and I have a few questions about that. The second, of
course, concerns the tax implications of the changes, and I shall come
to those
shortly.
I
am sure that all hon. Members are aware that landfill tax was
introduced in 1996 by the previous Conservative Government. It has
proved to be a useful tool in encouraging recycling and bearing down on
landfill. However, there is still some way to go when we see the rate
of our landfill compared with that of some of our European neighbours.
We welcome this move to use a better tool to encourage the clean-up of
contaminated land, but how effective will the switch to land
remediation relief be? The impact assessment states that £40
million in additional tax revenues is likely to come to HMRC as a
result of the changes. Where will that tax burden
fall?
Obviously,
there has been an issue with so-called dig and dump, whereby
developers have cleaned up contaminated land but dumped the surplus
into landfill, causing environmental issues. As I have said, I
understand the desire to move to on-site decontamination of
contaminated land, but has the Minister assessed the number of sites
where on-site decontamination is not possible? Clearly, there will be
some development sites where it will be impossible to decontaminate
land, so some developers will still need to use off-site
decontamination. Is there a Treasury assessment of how many sites will
be affected and of the level of landfill tax that will be charged on
sites that are currently
exempt?
The
background to the measure is the consultation on land remediation
relief that was carried out last year. Can the Minister tell us whether
the key stakeholders mentioned in the consultation paper felt that the
option currently being brought forwardoption 6would be
welcomed by the industry or whether they expressed concerns about its
impact?
Moving on to
the environmental aspect, I notice that not much detail was given about
the direct impact on CO2 emissions or about any other
environmental measurements by which we might be able to say whether the
measure has been effective vis-Ã -vis the environment.
Ultimately, such an impact is critical for the landfill tax. If there
is no direct impact on the environment, the measure simply becomes
another tax on business. It would be helpful to hear from the Minister
about any detailed review of the environmental impact. The impact
assessment states that there was a minor increase in CO2
emissions during the transitional period followed by a reduction.
The assessment goes into minute detail about the one-off costs of
£3,000, but some more detail about the environmental impact
would be welcome.
Another area
on which the Committee will be keen to hear answers relates to the
assessment of the increased tax yield of £40 million once the
exemption has been phased out. The first thing is to clarify is whether
that means £40 million per annum, which is how I read it. Can
the Minister confirm that? Obviously, that will be a net £40
million from an increase in landfill tax, which is often paid by local
authorities, less a reduction in corporation tax, which is paid by
companies. It would be helpful if the Minister could give us the two
aspects of the calculation that net off to £40 million. It is
important for local authorities to understand the Treasurys
assessment of the extra landfill tax they may be paying so that they
can manage their budgets.
In addition,
can the Minister provide us with a breakdown of the landfill tax
increase that will fall between local authorities and the private
sector? That will help us to understand who will bear the extra
£40 million a year. In the context of the
environmental questions that I asked a few moments ago, this is an
important issue£40 million is not an insubstantial
amount to take out of the economy every year. If that is the
Governments proposal, it is vital that we have some assurance
that there will be a discernible, measurable and positive environmental
impact.
Finally,
we have £40 million coming into the Treasury, but where will it
go? Recent answers to my parliamentary questions over the past couple
of weeks have confirmed that the Department for Environment, Food and
Rural Affairs budget to tackle fly tipping, which is a key aspect of
landfill and landfill tax, has been cut by £500,000, which is a
reduction of 25 per cent. in the Environment Agencys budget.
Does the Minister see the £40 million simply going into the
Exchequers black hole or will it be used to ensure that
environmental measures can be more successfully met? For example, it
could go to DEFRA to bolster the landfill communities fund, which I
understand is predicted to get £70 million in 2008-09, whereas
landfill tax is predicted to raise £1.1 billion. Will
the Minister talk about what will happen to that £40 million and
whether she feels that the landfill communities fund is receiving the
amount of landfill tax revenue envisaged by the Government at the
beginning of the
process?
4.41
pm
Dr.
John Pugh (Southport) (LD): Big projects are riding on
getting the regime for contaminated land right. The affordable housing
programme is concentrated on brownfield sites. The Olympic park is
being built on a highly contaminated
site.
As
I understand it, the statutory instrument simply suggests a taxation
switch. Previously, turning contaminated land into landfill was tax
exempt. Instead, there will now be a reduction in corporation tax or
the like from land remediation relief, which is being extended to
contaminated land. If it is achieved, it seems wholly laudable in terms
of the environmental effect. The object is presumably to have less
contaminated land dumped and more modern methods used. Presumably there
is also the expectation that £40 million will be in the
Treasurys coffers that previously was not
there.
Most
of us could support those motives in theory, provided that more and not
less contaminated land was reclaimed. That depends on a couple of
factors. First,
the fiscal incentives must be right so that the change does not lead to
people simply reclaiming less contaminated land and leaving land
contaminated. Secondly, the significant projects that are needed must
be able to take advantage of the new methods. The fiscal changes must
not discourage them again from addressing the issue of contaminated
land and leaving us with more of
it.
I
do not expect the Minister to answer my questions with any degree of
certainty because I am not sure that any of us knows the answers. Under
the heading Key Assumptions, the explanatory memorandum
states:
There
is significant uncertainty around the reduction in waste being sent to
landfill as a result of this change. The costs of landfill and of
alternative treatments are assumed to be roughly equal, based on
limited
information.
I
am left applauding the direction of travel, but worrying about the
element of uncertainty attached to the measures under consideration. I
am looking for an acknowledgement from the Minister that should the
scheme not work out as expected, there will be a process of review. Can
she assure us that before the introduction of the scheme, there was
thorough consultation with the people who know about contaminated land,
who are presumably developers by and
large?
4.44
pm
Mr.
Redwood: I wonder whether the Minister has studied the
analysis of costs and benefits as carefully as the Committee would
like. I notice that she has not personally signed the document, as is
clear in the typescript. There are some surprising lapses in the costs
and benefits, which probably means that, because of other pressures,
she has not looked at this as carefully as one might like. We are
invited to believe that the one-off transitional costs to everyone are
just £3,000. Is that conceivable for a set of proposals that
might lead to an increase in tax revenue of about £40 million?
That implies quite a lot of substantial projects across the whole of
the United
Kingdom.
We
are invited to believe that the annual average additional cost to
business would be zero. Like the hon. Member for Southport, I read that
the Government are proceeding on the assumption that alternative
methods of cleaning up land are fairly similar in cost and price. I am
not sure that that is true. Just like everybody else on this Committee,
I would like more land to be cleaned up, and I would like it to be done
in the most environmentally friendly way.
I suspect
that so much has been done by dumping to landfill because that is the
cheaper and easier option. I would therefore expect to see a rather
larger set of figures. I would also expect to see figures of some kind
under the average annual cost figures setting out the additional cost
of alternative procedures for tackling this land to give us a better
feel for whether this is going to be a restraint on getting more land
decontaminated.
If we look
further on, towards the bottom of the page there is nothing in the
column titled, What is the value of proposed offsetting measure
per year? It would be nice to have an explanation as to why
that part of the exercise has not been carried out. We also see that
there is no costing of the changes in greenhouse gas emissions, yet we
know that there are going to be changes in greenhouse gas emissions,
because the document tells us that in the middle paragraph.
The biggest
lapse of all that worries me is that, when we come to the section on
the annual cost per organisation, which is on these forms for the very
good reason that Members would like to see the impact of proposals on
very small, small, medium and large businesses, there are no figures at
all. Surely, if a proper exercise is being done to appraise such a
policy, one would start with that. As a Minister, I remember always
asking myself what, if it was a business-orientated policy, the impact
of my action would be on small, medium and big businesses? If the
policy would put a burden on the wider community, I asked myself how it
would affect different groups of
people.
When
we come to the part of the document on the impact on administrative
burdens baseline, we are asked to believe that it has a precise, tiny
decrease of £7,200. That would make me, as a Minister say,
I dont believe that. How can one be sure that
we would save £7,200 in an overall Government budget of
£600
billion?