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It was extremely valuable to hear the range and depth of discussion about the strategy review being undertaken by President Obama. I disagree with my hon. Friend the Member for Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney (Mr. Havard)-perhaps he was watching Fox News and I was watching the studio debates on the many other American television channels. I was impressed by the depth of some of the discussions in the media there and by the fact that the outcome was not predetermined and that people were willing to consider the pros and cons of various outcomes of the strategy review.
As has been said, my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister started Prime Minister's questions yesterday by reading out the names of the 37 servicemen who lost their lives while Parliament was in recess. It was a sombre reminder of the fight being undertaken by our military and highlighted their commitment and sacrifice, which everyone in the House and across the country should remember.
Also during the recess I had the opportunity, along with others, to attend a preview of a film, which was subsequently broadcast by the BBC, called "Wounded", which followed the processes undertaken by Tom and Andy as they returned to the UK, having been wounded in Afghanistan. The BBC had an agreement with the Ministry of Defence that it would follow the first two injured servicemen being returned. It had no prior knowledge of who those servicemen would be, where they would go or what their injuries would be.
The agreement was that the BBC would follow those servicemen as they returned to Selly Oak. If the families agreed, filming would continue, but if when the wounded person regained consciousness they said that they did not want to take part, the filming would cease and the BBC would restart with the next wounded person. Tom and Andy and their families both gave their permission for the filming to continue.
We should place on record our admiration for those two young people and their families. Their dignity, determination and sheer, unbounded guts exemplified our forces. They were picked at random, but they exemplified what we see day in, day out among the brave men and women who fight on behalf of this country.
We often criticise the BBC in this House. At times it is not our favourite institution, but for me that film also exemplified why we need the BBC. There was no edge to the film-it was honest and straightforward recording. The film told of a journey, of the hard work of all those at Selly Oak and Headley Court, and of the comradeship that gets people through. It was a wonderful piece of filming and it should be repeated on the BBC, because many people have missed it and would welcome the opportunity to see it.
However, it is possible to lose heart in our mission when we think about the troops we are losing. I cannot be the only Member who hears people asking why we are there and whether it is time we pulled out. I feel, however, that we must remain assertive and confident in our objective. We are there to end the safe haven provided to al-Qaeda and other terrorist organisations that threaten our freedom here in the west. The mission has not gone smoothly. The insurgents cannot defeat us militarily, but we can defeat ourselves. Uncertainty and a lack of clarity can dishearten our people and our allies, and embolden our foes.
Expectations when we entered Afghanistan were not realistic. We expected the coalition forces to roll in and blow the Taliban away, so that they would subsequently vanish and the job would be done. The terrain in Afghanistan is difficult-geographically and culturally. It is a unique tribal society with a culture vastly different from our own. There are numerous variations across the country, with ethnic, geographic and economic circumstances varying from one valley to the next. Many would say that, after 30 years of almost constant warfare, Afghanistan is a damaged society, in which many of the old tribal structures and relationships have also been damaged.
It was interesting to hear General McChrystal describe in his speech the problems associated with the digging of a well. He spoke of how the military's good intentions could cause huge political disruption, and his speech was important in highlighting the need for the new approach that we heard about in the strategy review in Washington, which described the need for consultation and the need to engage with the local community.
After eight years, we have reached a new stage in the war in Afghanistan-a stage at which we need to focus on supporting and defending the population instead of focusing on attacking and defeating the enemy. This means engaging, at political and community level, with the needs and priorities of the people of Afghanistan. That is no easy task. I welcome the deployment of an additional 500 troops to Helmand, but, along with extra troops from the UK and other NATO countries, we need a change of tactics. It is now time for counter-insurgency, and time for the Afghans to prepare to defeat the insurgency. This will require a combination of civilian and military efforts to contain and address the root causes of insurgencies and to reinforce the legitimacy of the Afghan Government at local, community, regional and national levels.
This is no cheap or quick solution; it is a long, high-cost strategy. Let us remember the years Britain took to develop its civil institutions, its legal system and trust in the police and criminal justice system. People in Afghanistan want much the same things that people want everywhere: jobs, financial security, economic growth, clean water, access to education and health, and the confidence to live their lives knowing that their Government are working to tackle corruption and crime while building security and stability. To achieve this, we need rapidly to increase the size of the Afghan security forces-both the army and the police-although I agree that there are issues of corruption within the police force.
We also need to connect more with the people we seek to protect. We need to respect the people we are there for. The Taliban are still not unpopular everywhere; they have proximity to some people and communities and are perceived in some areas to have the ability to provide some things, such as a basic rule of law. For many who support the Taliban, the main motivator is not ideology; it is hatred of the invader, inter-tribal conflict, revenge for military mistakes, or poverty and the opportunity to be fed and clothed.
The insurgents in Afghanistan might not have the capacity to defeat the allies through traditional warfare, but they can prolong the conflict and exhaust our public with the cost in human lives and money. Our task
is to close down their safe havens in neighbouring countries and cut down their access to international information and funds. We may not totally defeat the insurgents, but we can reduce their threat to the Government of Afghanistan. Helping to build stability in Pakistan will be essential to do that.
Following the recent elections in Afghanistan, there are clear shortfalls that will need addressing. President Karzai's credibility and the level of corruption in his Administration must be addressed. Equally, however, we must not forget that tremendous progress has been made in our eight years in Afghanistan: infrastructure has been developed, roads constructed, clean water provided, health care has become accessible and millions of girls now receive an education, boding well for the future. It is not just a matter of dropping more bombs, sending more troops, using more drones or keeping our troops off the roads and in the air-it is more subtle than that.
People ask me how we will know that we have succeeded. It is not Jeffersonian democracy, but a sort of modern-day Magna Carta that we must leave behind-a sovereign Government who uphold human rights and basic freedoms, respond to the demands of their people, impose limits on their power over citizens and respect an independent judiciary. Public support in the west will not remain indefinitely, and the support is edging away, day by day, at present. The cruel irony is that, in order to succeed, we need patience, discipline, resolve, time and humility.
Mr. Speaker: Order. At least eight Members are seeking to catch my eye, so a certain self-restraint is required of everybody contributing to the debate in order that everyone else who wants to is able to do so.
4.11 pm
Mr. Michael Jack (Fylde) (Con): The hon. Member for Bridgend (Mrs. Moon) rightly reminded us of the human dimension to all our defence debates. Yesterday's roll-call of honour of the 37 of our fallen servicemen who died while our Parliament was in recess is a chilling reminder of what we are talking about.
I am sometimes careful about straying outside what I call the comfort zone of the aerospace industry, about which I have acquired a detailed knowledge. I am always amazed at the expertise in the House in just about every area of defence, of which I have little knowledge, but I would like to spend a moment or two observing that we are in the run-up to a general election and that all parties are committed to a strategic defence review.
My observation on that is that we seem to be in an era of what I call entrepreneurial warfare, in which a man in a rubber boat can take out the USS Cole. Many in the House grew up at a time when the cold war was the prevalent threat-when there were big systems versus big systems and big armies were the answer to everything. We need to learn very quickly how to be much lighter on our feet in order to be able to respond to a world of continuing uncertainty. Who could have predicted that the use of commercial airliners as a weapon of war by those who attacked the US on 9/11 would fundamentally change what was done militarily over the previous decade, as witnessed by the invasion of Iraq and the current expedition in Afghanistan?
Many have sought to justify why it was right for us to participate in both those theatres and I accept the logic of what is put before us, but I would observe that in a world of 24/7 media coverage when members of the public have war thrust into their front rooms and see visions of the dead arriving back at Brize Norton, it adds a different dimension to how we need to debate the future of our defence policy. Members of the public are involved-and they are involving themselves, as witnessed by the strength of organisations such as Help for Heroes, which supports our forces-in a very different way than hitherto. Most people might have said that the annual poppy collection was the main way people showed their solidarity with the fallen and those who need help, but things are different now.
If we are to have a strategic defence review, all parties must in some way involve members of the public in understanding the purpose of defence. It is not just about the enemy offshore of the UK, as it takes in a global dimension. We must educate people to understand the purpose of our military expeditions. We in this place must be certain of why and when we want to intervene.
I hope that the debate on Afghanistan will reach some kind of conclusion shortly. If I were the enemy in this 24/7 world of the media and were listening to people agonise over whether we have the right equipment, whether we know what we are doing in Afghanistan and what is the reason for it, I would be rubbing my hands with glee. That is what the enemy must be doing, because they are receiving the message that the people whom they regard as their enemy do not have a clear clue what they are doing. They are ill equipped, they have no strategy, and they are falling out with each other. This thing called NATO is not working. All that must give the enemy tremendous encouragement
The sooner we coalesce around a plan and make it work, the better, because that will provide the platform on which the strategic defence review will take place. What slightly worries me about the SDR-and I have noticed this so many times in the House-is that when a convenient event in the future allows us to shovel all the difficult issues of today on to tomorrow, we tend to over-egg what an SDR can do. If we were so imbued with brilliant foresight, we would be continually adjusting the way in which we run our armed forces and our defence policy so that we would know what was around the corner. We would adjust our procurement, and so forth. These one-off long gaps between one SDR and the next push to the very limits the credibility of how far we can see into the future.
If there is one thing that I have observed, it is that in a world of entrepreneurial war in which the enemy is light on its feet and capitalises on weakness, it tends to say-the improvised explosive device is but one example of this-"We do not have the big systems, but we do have a very effective way of disturbing the enemy." We therefore need to be flexible, innovative and technologically clever. We need to be able to move in and out of theatres quickly, and that requires helicopters and lift capacity. We need equipment that gives us mobility and flexibility. The amount that we will need in the future is a question for experts, but those seem to me to be the key elements that perhaps distinguish the future from the past, when we bought big chunks of kit because we were dealing with a very different situation.
Mr. Ellwood: My right hon. Friend is advancing a powerful argument in explaining why the military need to move forward and understand the threats of the day. I am pleased that the procurement Minister-the Under-Secretary of State for Defence, the hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford (Mr. Davies)-has returned to the Chamber. Does my hon. Friend agree that the invention used by the Germans and the Americans, vehicle-bound radar, needs to be procured immediately for our troops in Afghanistan?
Mr. Jack: Indeed. My hon. Friend has made a good point. Technology will play a vital part in future warfare. Future warfare will not necessarily be in the Afghanistans of this world. For example, we recently saw the Russians involve themselves in cyber-warfare against Estonia. We do not have debates about cyber-warfare in the House, because it is not something in which we appear to be directly involved, but it is just as much of a threat to our systems in this country as what I might call the more conventional manifestation of warfare.
Mr. Brazier: This is, of course, one of the reasons why we need more citizen forces. Civilian technology is always well ahead of military technology.
Mr. Jack: I defer to my hon. Friend's knowledge, because he knows a great deal about these matters, but in any case I agree with him. Lord Drayson is a good exemplification of the way in which a bridge was built between industry and the Ministry of Defence to create a good rapport over the use of technologies.
Someone who knows a great deal more about defence than I do has said that, whatever the scenario, in the first instance we should send the enemy the message that we have what he described as a terrifying response. In other words, we say to the enemy, "If you have a go, you too will get more than a bloody nose in return." That means that in some circumstances we do have to have the big kit with the big hit, but the terrifying response can manifest itself in many ways. We need to be flexible as we approach the next strategy defence review.
It will not surprise you to learn, Mr. Speaker, that I want to spend the remaining moments of my time considering the aerospace industry. Over the summer there were some dispiriting reports. Now that the Government have at long last decided on tranche 3 of the Eurofighter, people are saying that when Eurofighter comes to an end, BAE Systems Warton in my constituency-the home of military aircraft production and expertise in the United Kingdom-will close. Many people have been deeply worried about that. I say to my own Front-Bench colleagues that some of their observations and attitudes towards a number of defence projects have also caused worries; the idea of a review of the Eurofighter Typhoon project has created an air of uncertainty, for example.
It would be helpful if the Government spelled out the penalties that will result if people go monkeying around with what has been agreed. The RAF will not get the 232 aircraft that were originally committed to. A number of those aircraft have been sold to a very good customer: Saudi Arabia. If we carry on having this kind of dialogue, in which people across the political spectrum undermine the Eurofighter, we will miss out on a tremendous
opportunity. It has been calculated that there is a market of some £90 billion-worth of ageing fighter fast jet capacity that will need to be replaced. The alternative to the Eurofighter is the much more expensive United States F-35 joint strike fighter. I would far rather the Eurofighter Typhoon consortium had the benefit of those orders, but unless we get behind the aircraft and show commitment towards it, we will not realise that opportunity.
This is important not from the point of view of jobs alone, as the Eurofighter Typhoon sustains the technology base that is our aerospace industry. I was delighted when the Secretary of State talked about the deployment in the Afghanistan theatre of HERTI, an unmanned air reconnaissance vehicle. I am delighted that a piece of technology that was manufactured in short order using relatively simple aerospace technology but very advanced electronics is now playing a part in Afghanistan and showing the way forward.
Mr. Quentin Davies: I think the right hon. Gentleman will find that the Government are a much better friend to him on this subject than his Front-Bench colleagues. As with carriers, we are completely committed to Typhoon tranche 3. We are going ahead with that-we are on contract for it-so his constituents have work now for the next four or five years even if there are no export orders. We are going for more export orders, however; I shall visit Japan next week on precisely that subject.
Mr. Jack: I am delighted that the Minister is pursuing the Japanese option, but in fairness to my Front-Bench colleagues they did insert an important caveat into their observations. They admitted that they may not be privy to what the Minister is privy to, which are precisely the clauses that would readjust the work-share to the disadvantage of the United Kingdom and on the compensation that would have to be paid. Now that they are aware of that, they might take a revised view. It is not fair to criticise the Opposition for wanting to question the decisions of a Government who at times have been found wanting in the world of defence, as many speeches in the course of this debate have shown.
The underpinning of our aerospace industry gives us the opportunity to go beyond the HERTI aircraft. The Government and BAE are working on a further exemplification of an unmanned air system known as Mantis, a much more advanced system that might ultimately be developed into an offensive capability. That illustrates the future of our aerospace system. We need to maintain this expertise in the UK. I hope the strategic defence review will recognise that in spite of the temptation to buy something that somebody else makes, there is a very good case for having our own capability in certain strategic areas. Mr. Deputy Speaker, if the Government can recognise that naval architecture and the building of ships- [Interruption.] I apologise, Mr. Speaker, I would not want in anyway to downgrade your recently elevated status. We must maintain the strategic capability in aerospace, just as it is recognised that ship construction is also a strategic capability for the United Kingdom.
It would be helpful if the Government were to repeat the BAE acknowledgement that BAE Warton is effectively the only military airfield with a big enough runway to
deal with everything from Tornados and Typhoons through to the Nimrod MR4A. It has got the telemetry equipment, the people and the necessary expertise to sustain an aerospace industry that in the north-west accounts for some 40,000 jobs-and directly in terms of Eurofighter Typhoons some 4,000 jobs-as well as another 10,000 jobs in the subcontracting industry. It is an industry of which we can be truly proud, because without the technology that came from the Eurofighter Typhoon we would not be involved in the joint strike fighter project and 10 per cent. of the work of that project would not be being done at Samlesbury in Lancashire. There are not only good military reasons for these systems, but good economic outcomes for the United Kingdom. I hope that the need to maintain technological excellence will be one of the key factors that will inform the strategic defence review, whomsoever-I hope it will be the Conservatives-form the next Government.
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