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Kevin Brennan: Indeed, Madam Deputy Speaker. There is a relevance, as I shall show in a moment.
The hon. Member for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (Mr. Gibb) made a new distinction between "what we want" and "what our policy says we want". We all know what he means-that there will be one league table for the academic results, which in his eyes will be the equivalent of the premiership, and another league table, which will be the equivalent of the Vauxhall conference, because there is no commitment to parity of esteem for vocational education from the Opposition. That is what the Bill and the amendments are about.
In his usual entertaining and eloquent way, the hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings (Mr. Hayes) told us his position and welcomed many of the amendments, as I did in my opening remarks. He tried, in typical and understandable fashion, to open up a false dichotomy or distinction between the Government's position on sector skills councils and regional development agencies. Both are important. It was important for the hon. Gentleman to make his point because he wants to cut regional development agencies, despite the huge multiplier effect that they have on local economies, as has been shown by research. He wants to cut them away, if he ever gets the opportunity to do so.
We recognise that both are important in the skills agenda. Regional skills strategies will reflect the relevant national and sectoral priorities, and regional development agencies will work with sector skills councils, employers, local authorities and others to ensure that those sectoral priorities are articulated. There is no dilution of commitment by the Government to the sector skills councils, which we helped to set up and with which we work closely.
I will not go into the hon. Gentleman's anxious desire yet again to wave his so-called secret document, except to remind the House that it was agreed as part of this year's Budget that we would be seeking the savings outlined in the document to which he refers. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government, in his previous role as Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities and Skills, wrote publicly to the Learning and Skills Council in May this year outlining that.
The hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings referred to level 3 apprenticeships. The expansion of those apprenticeships announced in the White Paper earlier this afternoon was widely welcomed across the House. In recent years, the proportion of level 3 apprenticeship starts has remained at about 30 per cent., increasing to 32 per cent. in 2007-08 and 34 per cent. in 2008-09. In fact, they are at an all-time high because the number of apprenticeships has been growing generally, so I think that the hon. Gentleman and I will have to agree to disagree on that.
The hon. Gentleman asked whether the alternative completion conditions constituted a loophole in terms of the standard of apprenticeships. The regulations will set down the criteria for alternative completion conditions, and they will require affirmative resolutions in both Houses. I can assure him that those conditions do not create a loophole. Those conditions are necessary in order to ensure, for example, that apprentices who are made redundant may complete their apprenticeship on
an unpaid basis, and to deliver pre-apprenticeship contract periods for young people on third sector schemes- mentioned in the House earlier this afternoon-provided by organisations such as Barnardo's and Rathbone. Indeed, those conditions were included in the Bill very much at the request of organisations that engage in that kind of pre-apprenticeship training. I hope that those remarks have reassured him.
Mr. Hayes: While the Minister is in the mood to give assurances, can he finally wrap up the matter of sector skills councils? The amendments, reinforced by some of the remarks in the White Paper-although I feel that there is a contradiction between the RDAs and SSCs in this respect-make it clear that sector skills councils will play a critical role in approving qualifications. How can that be squared with the rationalisation of their number given their diverse range of responsibilities and the very wide range of those qualifications?
Kevin Brennan: I am confident that, as we speak, sector skills councils and employer-led organisations are working together to rationalise their number because they themselves recognise that there are too many bodies and that there is therefore a need for such rationalisation. They do not want Government to specify a particular number, and we have not done so, for the very reason that there should be an employer-led approach. I would have thought that the hon. Gentleman welcomes a decluttering of the skills system, particularly where it is employer-led, as in this case, and given that it has been recommended by the UK Commission for Employment and Skills and that employers are working together to bring this about in a manner that makes sense for the economy and for those industries and sectors. He is right to point out that the amendments strengthen and clarify the role of sector skills councils in relation to apprenticeship frameworks.
The hon. Gentleman mentioned careers and information advice and guidance, as did my hon. Friend the Member for Blackpool, South (Mr. Marsden). A careers profession taskforce is to be established, and it will report in 2010. Careers education and statutory guidance for schools, including comprehensive information and advice on apprenticeships, will be part of that, and adherence will be inspected by Ofsted. There will be a full-scale review of the requirements of careers specialists and the Teacher Development Agency in relation to resources and professional development for all teachers. We are creating a new adult advancement and careers service, working in partnership with Jobcentre Plus. Once that is up and running, then we will, in 2011, consider the effectiveness of those arrangements for joint working and whether any further changes are needed.
My hon. Friend the Member for Blackpool, South made an extremely thoughtful and interesting contribution about information, advice and guidance, reminding us that this is not about putting extra burdens on teaching professionals. He also reminded us about the ways that young people these days like to access and experience information, advice and guidance on careers. His contribution was extremely helpful.
Mr. Hayes: Before the Minister sits down, will he say a word about amendments 84 to 86-those recommended by Lord Layard?
Kevin Brennan: I think I may have to refer to my notes and do that in a moment. First, I wish to refer to the remarks of the hon. Member for Bristol, West (Stephen Williams), who was concerned about whether the expected provision of information, advice and guidance on apprenticeships had been strengthened by the amendments. I can give him that assurance. The Government always intended that information should be given to everybody, not only to those whom the giver thought might be suitable for an apprenticeship. We recognised that our original drafting did not make that clear, and we have improved it, but our intention to ensure that everybody had information about apprenticeships was never in doubt.
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On the question the hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings has just asked me, I understand that Lord Layard's concern was that the term "scheme" was redolent of projects introduced during the 1980s, such as the youth training scheme, and that it might be deemed a derogatory term if it were used rather than one such as "offer", which is much more positive. That was the reason for the change. It was a semantic change, but nevertheless one that the Government were happy to accept.
Lords amendments 2 to 33 agreed to.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families (Mr. Iain Wright): I beg to move, That this House agrees with Lords amendment 34.
Madam Deputy Speaker: With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments 35 to 38, 40 to 42, 65 to 71, 74, 77 to 82, 86, 113, 116, 117, 177 and 179 to 186.
Mr. Wright: The amendments are concentrated on crucial changes to the machinery of government to improve the delivery of education to young people and adults, and they demonstrate that we have listened to and taken seriously concerns from all sections of this House and the other place and worked hard to address them.
As the House will recall, local authorities will be supported in their new central role in commissioning services for 16 to 19-year-olds by the new Young People's Learning Agency. "Supported" is the right word, because the YPLA will be there to assist local authorities, not tell them what to do. That was always our clear intention. Throughout the passage of the Bill we have listened to those who were concerned that that principle was not always obvious, and we have accordingly made a series of amendments to clarify our intention and make it more explicit in the Bill.
Lords amendment 67 stipulates that when the YPLA uses its powers to commission provision, it must have regard to things done by local authorities as they perform their new duties in relation to young people aged 16 to 19, those aged 19 to 25 with a learning difficulty assessment and those subject to youth detention. Lords amendment 68 means that the YPLA will have to have approval from the Secretary of State before giving a direction to a
local authority that is failing, or likely to fail, in its duties to secure provision for those groups of young people. I am due shortly to publish a consultation draft of the national commissioning framework, and I want to make it clear in that document that the powers in question will be used only as a very last resort and after all options of support and challenge have been explored and exhausted.
Lords amendment 70 extends the YPLA's duty to issue guidance to local authorities to cover other aspects of their new role.
Lords amendment 71 would give the YPLA a duty to consult local authorities and other persons it considered appropriate before issuing guidance about performance by local authorities of their new duties.
Lords amendments 179 and 180 set out that the first chief executive is to be appointed by the Secretary of State and later chief executives will be appointed by the YPLA, subject to the Secretary of State's approval. That is entirely consistent with the approach to other non-departmental public bodies. I know that the Opposition have some concerns about that, but, having listened to the anxieties expressed in the other place, we are of the opinion that the recruitment of an executive employee should be carried out by the employer-in this instance, the YPLA-rather than be a public appointment by the Secretary of State. We do not believe that the amendment would lead to an increased separation of the YPLA from the Secretary of State, but that it gives the YPLA, like other NDPBs, a sensible amount of power to appoint its own chief executive, subject to approval by the Secretary of State.
Mr. Laws: Are there other examples of that approach in non-departmental public bodies?
Mr. Wright: Last year, I took the Housing and Regeneration Bill through the House, and the appointment of the chief executive of the Homes and Communities Agency was almost entirely-word for word-consistent with the approach in the Bill. We are clear that that will not affect the clear lines of ministerial responsibility for the YPLA. The Secretary of State, through his remit letter to the YPLA, will set out the tasks that it must perform, including any necessary operational details, and the YPLA will be accountable to the Secretary of State, and hence to Parliament, for its performance and management. Its funding will be accounted for in the Department's expenditure plans. Under clause 75, the Secretary of State can give directions to the YPLA.
We had included a requirement for the YPLA, the Skills Funding Agency and local authorities to avoid provision that might give rise to disproportionate expenditure. Concerns were raised in another place that that could result in higher cost provision for learners with special needs no longer being made available-a possible get-out clause. That was never our intention. To minimise such concerns, we have removed the phrase "disproportionate expenditure". However, it is important to point out that we still expect those bodies to make the best use of their resources. Local authorities are already subject to best value duties under the Local Government Act 1999. The YPLA and the chief executive of the Skills Funding Agency are still required by the Bill to make the best use of their resources.
Lords amendment 41 introduces a requirement to consult governing bodies and other relevant parties
before a local authority exercises its power to direct a college to take a named individual. I must stress that that is not a new power, but an existing power, which the Learning and Skills Council already has. The amendment would make explicit in the Bill the need for local authorities not to force through their wishes without consideration for governing bodies, but to consult any relevant colleges.
Although the majority of young people will find a suitable place to study further education with relative ease, we must ensure that local authorities have the tools and levers at their disposal to support the minority of young people who may struggle to find a suitable place of learning where they can thrive and achieve. In exercising that power, local authorities will be required to have regard to any guidance provided by the Secretary of State. We imagine that such a power would be used only in exceptional circumstances, and only once a young person, supported by independent advice and guidance, often through the local Connexions service, has exhausted all the available options. The amendment is particularly important to enable local authorities to support some of our more vulnerable groups of young people, such as ex-offenders, children in care or care leavers, who often face additional barriers to participation, to find a place to continue their education.
The powers are particularly relevant and necessary in the context of the historic legislation to raise the participation age. We want to ensure that no young person is disadvantaged and considered in default of their statutory duties just because they have been unable to find a suitable learning place. We believe that the change brought about by the amendment, which reflects what we would expect local authorities to do anyway, will help to reassure colleges about the use of that power.
Sixth-form colleges are some of our most successful educational institutions, popular with pupils and parents. I should like to mention Hartlepool sixth-form college, where I came from, which, in one of its first public acts since opening its new £24 million redevelopment, courtesy of Government money, played host on Friday evening to the BBC's "Any Questions?" and is a great example of the high-quality educational offer that sixth-form colleges can provide. The Bill will build on that success by creating a separate sixth-form college designation, enabling them to evolve as a sector.
Lords amendment 182 reduces the period before a sixth-form college can redesignate as a further education college from five to two years. Lords amendments 181 and 183 to 186 create a requirement for local authorities and the YPLA to consult governing bodies before using their powers to appoint governors. Again, we always expected that that would happen. Although the creation of the new designation has been generally popular, we hope that the changes in the Lords amendments will help to reassure sixth-form colleges about the operation of the new arrangements, and in particular show our intention to preserve the autonomy of sixth-form college governing bodies.
Lords amendments 34 to 37, 40, 42, 74, 77, 78, 81, 82, 116 and 117 are minor and technical changes to improve and clarify the drafting.
I hope that I have fully explained the reasoning behind the Lords amendments.
Mr. Hayes: As the Under-Secretary said, the second group of amendments contains minor improvements, which we broadly welcome. He made it clear that Lords amendment 67 clarifies the relationship between the YPLA and local authorities, and that is helpful.
We have consistently argued that sixth-form colleges should be able to convert to a further education corporation after two rather than five years from when a sixth form college corporation is declared. I acknowledge that the Government have now accepted that argument.
The Government also conceded our point about requiring the YPLA and sixth-form colleges to consult the SFA before appointing someone to the board.
As the Under-Secretary said, Lords amendment 68 would make it clear that the YPLA had to get approval from the Secretary of State before issuing a direction to a failing authority.
Nevertheless, the amendments do not address the fundamental problems of the structure that the Bill proposes. The recession should surely have taught us that we need a dynamic and responsive system. Instead, the Bill represents the needless bureaucratisation of the management and funding of FE, skills, and in particular the apprenticeship system.
The abolition of the LSC, the creation of the three new agencies-the YPLA, the SFA and a National Apprenticeship Service-and the placing of further education under LEA control create a system whereby everyone has a say, but no one takes responsibility. Consequently, and perhaps without appropriate thought or planning, I suspect that the new system will be as bad as the LSC and possibly worse. It is more bureaucratic, has a greater capacity for contradiction, overlapping responsibilities and confused lines of accountability. At the very least, it is a wasted opportunity, given that we are getting rid of the LSC.
Represented diagrammatically, the system would be a mix of a Jackson Pollock painting and a Heath Robinson drawing. Represented musically, it would be Iron Maiden playing Shostakovich. It is, at best, an extremely muddled and mixed system. At worst, it risks jeopardising the interests of business, learners and the economy as a whole.
It is extraordinary that to that littered landscape the Government are adding a new, big role for regional development agencies. The many Government amendments we are now considering are an indication of just how complicated, and in my judgement unworkable, the arrangements that the Bill puts in place are likely to be in practice.
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Amendment 180, which is to schedule 3-on the appointment of the chief executive of the YPLA-would enable
"Later chief executives...to be appointed"
"the YPLA...on conditions of service determined by the YPLA".
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