Examination of Witnesses (Question Numbers
60-65)
MR NIGEL
LONG, MR
MICHAEL GELLING
OBE AND MS
TRISH CANHAM
26 OCTOBER 2009
Q60 Alison Seabeck: It has been a
catalyst for discussion?
Mr Gelling: If nothing else, the
TSA has done that, and you will find that a lot more tenants now
are a lot more streetwise about regulation and expectations.
Q61 Alison Seabeck: Can I say, I
was really encouraged by what you were saying, but how much of
the new engagement is with people who are within the private sector,
private sector tenants and their landlords? I mean, it is largely
social, housing associations?
Mr Gelling: We have not a membership
with any private tenant but we do meet private tenants at many
of the conferences that we go to, because they come along, and
it is like a second class citizen as far as rented accommodation
are concerned. They do not have the same regulation, they do not
have the same accountability with their landlord, or their landlord
has to them; the regulation is not there. So it is a different
world, and people actually aspire to be in our sector.
Q62 Chair: Final, final question:
Ms Canham, are you suggesting that the Decent Homes standard should
be extended to owner occupiers?
Ms Canham: Yes, most definitely.
Q63 Chair: How would you see that
working? What if an owner occupier is living in a home below a
decent standard, is it to be declared unfit?
Ms Canham: I know this is not
easy, but I think it should probably be extended through the planning
system. We hear all these stories that have been in the press
recently about rabbit hutch Britain, the smallest new build in
the whole of Europe. I think we have a generation of young people
who are going to be condemned to living in the most—
Q64 Chair: So are you suggesting
it is new homes that vulnerable people are living in that are
below decent standards?
Ms Canham: No, there are two issues
here. There are the older homes which are obviously unsuitable,
the owners cannot afford to repair them, there is a large proportion
of those, but also if we think about decent homes as a vision
for the future, I think somewhere it needs to be incorporated
that we need standards that will prevent slums of the future being
built privately, because there are huge estates being built over
the past few years where people do not have the basic space. I
mean, the Government has regulations, for instance, for recycling,
but there is nowhere within these tiny pods, as they are called,
where you could possibly do things like that, where young children
have no room to study, to do their homework.
Q65 Chair: That is hugely beyond
the Decent Homes standard.
Ms Canham: Yes, I know what you
are saying, but in a way, the vision that is encompassed in Decent
Homes should perhaps be incorporated into something else which
covers what we are building in this country for the future.
Mr Long: Could I just add something
on owner occupation, because, of course, what has happened is
demographic trends are having a major impact upon owner occupiers,
because we have got an increasingly elderly owner occupier population,
and that throws up a whole series of big policy issues, and that
is where this whole relationship between health and housing, the
strategic role of housing is so important. My take on this would
be that we have to ensure that by Decent Homes in the owner occupied
sector, we are talking about increasingly making sure those properties
are accessible and remain mobility friendly as people age, another
huge issue around low income BME owner occupiers and how we address
their needs, but it is to do with the aging population, and the
fact that owner occupation has taken in a bigger number of lower
income households. That has to be addressed at some point, but
I think that is probably beyond your remit.
Chair: I think it is. Thank you very
much indeed.
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