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9.27 pm

Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab): Time restraints mean that I will keep my contribution brief, Mr Deputy Speaker, and address only one aspect of this wide-ranging Bill—the proposals relating to whistleblowing. Of course, the Secretary of State did not address them in his opening contribution, although the Labour Front-Bench team have indicated that they will look at these issues in detail in Committee.

The provisions in this Bill will amend the landmark Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998, which was introduced by the previous Government after many years—decades, in fact—of campaigning by those seeking to have whistleblowing legislation in this country. It put the UK at the forefront of corporate governance legislation at the time of its introduction. The Government’s amendment has the effect of introducing a public interest test into that Act, which I believe will weaken the legislation for anybody wishing to rely on it. I understand that the Government say that they are proposing this amendment in this way in order to overcome a legal loophole, which has resulted in part from the case of Parkins v. Sodexho Ltd. However, those who have been campaigning on this issue, such as Public Concern at Work, are extremely concerned that introducing this proposal in this way will weaken the legislation for everybody. There is no doubt that a loophole needs to be addressed in respect of that legal case, but the concern is that the Government’s amendment will not address it and instead will make it more difficult for anybody wanting to rely on the legislation. There is no doubt that after more than a decade of the Act being relied on in this country we need to look at this area again. There is no doubt that we need to improve the legislation and learn the lessons of experiences over the past decade and more.

We need to look at vicarious liability, which cannot be relied on by people trying to use the 2008 Act. Recently, three nurses in Manchester who were concerned that their colleague had lied about their qualifications were unable to rely on the original legislation because it did not deal with vicarious liability.

Other aspects highlighted by recent employment cases also need to be considered. The Government accept that there are difficulties with certain groups using the legislation, such as students on vocational placements, general practitioners and others. There is no doubt that the scope of the Act needs to be widened. Indeed, we need a separate public interest category, as there is in the United States.

Those who have campaigned on whistleblowing are clear that the Bill is a step backwards. They are calling for a full public consultation—there has been no

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consultation whatever so far—and a thorough review of the law on whistleblowing. I ask the Government to listen to what those campaigners are saying, initiate that review, look again at the proposal in the Bill, think again, and return with proposals that will strengthen whistleblowing in this country rather than weaken it.

9.31 pm

Mr Iain Wright (Hartlepool) (Lab): This has been an important if somewhat curtailed debate. In the time we have had, 21 hon. Members from all parties made considered and high-quality speeches, with the exception of Lib Dem Back Benchers and Scottish National party Members, who made no speeches, high quality or otherwise.

Since the Secretary of State rose at 5.44 pm to open the debate, 1,368 new companies have been registered in Russia, the country with the largest and fastest-growing number of business start-ups anywhere on earth; 21,394 passenger cars have been manufactured in China; 975 patents have been filed in the US; 338 people have enrolled on engineering degrees in India; and 60,000 iPhones and 20,250 iPads have been manufactured and sold around the world. Any enterprise Bill that the House considers must tackle on behalf of British business that unprecedented level of intense international competition.

That is an urgent task because, as we have heard, we are slipping down the league tables of global competitiveness. As my hon. Friend the Member for Streatham (Mr Umunna) said in his excellent opening speech, according to the World Bank’s global survey of doing business, when the Government took office, Britain was fourth in the world in terms of the ease of doing business; it is now seventh. Across the different categories, our competitiveness is slipping alarmingly. On the ease of starting a business, we have slipped from 16th to 19th; on dealing with construction permits, we have slipped from 16th to 22nd; and on registering property, we have slipped from 23rd to 35th. We are now ranked 60th in the world on companies gaining access to electricity, behind the likes of Chile, Belize, Costa Rica, Guatemala and Iraq.

The task is made even more urgent because the Government’s policies have pushed the British economy into reverse and into recession. As my hon. Friend rightly said, when the Government took office, the British economy was growing. Since the spending review, it has shrunk by 0.4%. We are now in a double-dip recession made in Downing street. Fifty businesses are going under each and every single day.

The Chancellor may wish to blame the weather, even though this country has seen weather before. He may wish to blame, as he did at the weekend, high oil prices, even though oil was trading in London this morning at a 17-month low and the price of Brent crude is 25% of its March peak. He may wish to blame the jubilee, or the eurozone, which he may claim is killing Britain’s prospects for growth, but even now Tory MPs are wising up to the fact that he is looking for excuses or alibis. They are questioning the political genius and economic competence of the man who gave them the pasty tax and raised taxes for pensioners while providing tax cuts for multi-millionaires. It is not business that should stop whinging and work harder, as the Foreign Secretary suggests, it is the part-time Chancellor.

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The Bill could have addressed such failures. It has been trailed in the media as the flagship piece of legislation to make enterprise, growth and competitiveness this Administration’s principal policy. It is hardly that. Instead it is a mishmash, an ad hoc rag-bag of measures, as my hon. Friend the Member for West Bromwich West (Mr Bailey), the Chair of the Business, Innovation and Skills Committee, and my hon. Friend the Member for Great Grimsby (Austin Mitchell) said. It reflects a Government who, after only two years in office, have run out of ideas. There is no strategic thread, no compelling vision and nothing that will provide real help for British enterprise, as my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow North East (Mr Bain) eloquently pointed out in a powerful contribution.

The Bill’s span is wide. For example, clause 50 concerns heritage planning legislation and clause 51 deals with the Equality and Human Rights Commission. Incidentally, my hon. Friends the Members for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Sandra Osborne) and for Stretford and Urmston (Kate Green) made powerful speeches about that clause. I absolutely agree with them, and we will oppose the measure firmly in Committee. There is also clause 56, which deals with copyright. That wide span does not really show an Administration confident in their approach and clear about their aims for the British economy. Instead, it exposes a situation in which Ministers are desperately trailing around Whitehall asking for off-the-shelf proposals to pad out a supposedly flagship Bill. British business deserves better.

Businesses are crying out for a productive partnership with Government. They want to work together on a long-term vision for the British economy in the next few decades and put in place a powerful industrial strategy to allow Britain to thrive. However, there is nothing of substance in the Bill that will allow such a strategy to materialise.

Several hon. Members, such as my hon. Friends the Members for Glasgow North East, for West Bromwich West and for Swansea West (Geraint Davies), mentioned the Bill’s provision for the establishment of the green investment bank. We support the principles of such a bank. Indeed, it was under the previous Labour Government that the decision to establish one was taken. However, this Government’s two-year delay and dither has meant that the UK is slipping ever further behind our global competitors in investment in green growth. We have fallen from third in the world for investment in clean technology when Labour left power to seventh in the world today.

Even though I can see the point that investment rose last year, Pew Research has stated that that was largely because

“investors rushed to initiate projects before policy reforms go into effect that could curtail incentives”—

reforms such as the botched feed-in tariff. From a position in which we could have taken a first-mover premium in the new global manufacturing sector, the Government are losing this country our competitive advantage. Earlier this year the chief executive of Vestas, the world’s largest wind turbine maker, said that his company was postponing investment in the UK, stating:

“The most important issue that our customers have is a long-term policy framework that is required to put in these investments, which are huge.”

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However, he said that

“we have not had reassurance from the government.”

As we have heard, the situation has been made worse by the fact that the Government continue to cause uncertainty and delay as a result of the Treasury’s refusal to allow the green investment bank to borrow until 2016 at the earliest. The hon. Members for Lancaster and Fleetwood (Eric Ollerenshaw) and for Stroud (Neil Carmichael)—I do not see the latter in his place—raised that issue. A bank that does not borrow cannot be called a bank, as my right hon. Friend the Member for Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey) and my hon. Friend the Member for Stoke-on-Trent North (Joan Walley) said in powerful interventions. Investment and leverage from the private sector now, while the economy is in a double-dip recession, could help us get into recovery and out of this mess. As my hon. Friend the Member for Foyle (Mark Durkan) said, there is a risk that the green investment bank will not be as active a driver in economic recovery as it should.

A large number of hon. Members, certainly on the Labour Benches, rightly mentioned their concerns about the proposed changes to employment legislation. My hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West (Julie Hilling), for example, brought to bear her considerable experience in the matter. My hon. Friend the Member for Blaydon (Mr Anderson) said that the proposals were based on bias, “Back to the Future”, opinion, anecdote and prejudice. My hon. Friend the Member for North Ayrshire and Arran (Katy Clark) mentioned whistleblowing, and we will certainly be raising and looking closely at that in Committee.

The hon. Member for Stourbridge (Margot James) said that in her opinion health and safety legislation is a burden. I do not know whether she commemorates workers’ memorial day every 28 April, but the people who have been injured and the families who have lost loved ones will not think that health and safety legislation is a burden.

The hon. Member for Bury St Edmunds (Mr Ruffley) cited two cases from his constituency, in the retail sector of all sectors. He said that the biggest burden facing the retail sector was not the lack of demand, the lack of consumer confidence or the rise in VAT imposed by this Government, but unfair dismissal. The idea that business growth is being held back by burdensome employment regulation is simply absurd.

I would say to the hon. Member for Northampton South (Mr Binley)—I have a lot of affection for him and know that he has long decades of experience in business—that, as my hon. Friend the Member for Streatham said, only 6% of businesses said that regulation was the main barrier to growth, with nearly half saying that the biggest obstacle to business success was the dire state of the economy.

Mr Binley rose

Mr Wright: I am sure that the hon. Gentleman will agree with me.

Mr Binley: Does the Opposition spokesman, for whom I have equal affection, recognise that those people would have placed it at the very top of the list if the previous Labour Government had not created so many economic

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problems that of course other matters came before it? None the less, most people named it as one of the problems.

Mr Wright: The hon. Gentleman is a wily old bird and he knows that the economy is in recession not because of the UK employment regime or because there is somehow a need to make it easier to fire workers at will, but because, as my hon. Friend the Member for Great Grimsby said, the Government have choked off demand by cutting spending too fast and raising taxes such as VAT too far. As my hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West pointed out, removing the rights of workers will only have the impact of increasing job insecurity, thereby damaging work force morale, productivity and confidence precisely at the time when we need to see more confidence flowing through the economy.

The Government have repeatedly and pointedly failed to rule out the prospect of Beecroft’s recommendations being brought forward as amendments to the Bill. The Secretary of State was somewhat vague on that matter. After penetrating interventions from my hon. Friend the shadow Secretary of State and my hon. Friend the Member for Stretford and Urmston, the Secretary of State said that as far as he was aware—although it is his Bill—he did not see any prospect of that occurring. I hope that the Minister will make the Government’s position crystal clear on the implementation of the Beecroft recommendations during the Bill’s passage through Parliament. I hope he will confirm that none of Beecroft’s recommendations will be in amendments tabled to the Bill and that he will work with us in Committee to ensure that any such amendments from Back Benchers will be rejected. I know that the hon. Member for Bedford (Richard Fuller) wants to table such an amendment and I look forward to working with him—or against him—in Committee.

Hon. Members also raised the proposals on directors’ remuneration in part 6. We have made it clear that although we are generally supportive of what the Government are doing, the proposals do not go nearly far enough. We need greater accountability and transparency, and the recent shareholder spring, which involved many companies, suggests that investors believe that, too.

Reports in the weekend media suggested that the Government will not empower shareholders with an annual binding vote on remuneration for executives, requiring it instead only every three years. Previously, the Secretary of State has rightly stated that an annual binding vote would provide investors with a powerful tool to hold executives to account, particularly as regards failure. He pledged that again today, which is very welcome. We intend to press forward in Committee with amendments to this part of the Bill to ensure that the matter is dealt with comprehensively and fairly and that all the recommendations of the High Pay Commission are implemented, including those that workers sit on remuneration committees.

Parts 3 and 4 will establish the competition and markets authority; the purpose is to improve the speed, quality and robustness of decision making. We Labour Members are keen to ensure that the competition regime in this country is the best in the world, so that innovation and imagination are rewarded; in that respect, I agree with the hon. Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford (Mr Evennett). When the Government came to power, the UK’s competitive environment was seen as one of

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the best in the world—third behind only the US and Germany—so it is of concern that on this Government’s watch, the

Global Competition Review

has downgraded the status of the Office of Fair Trading, following what it termed the OFT’s “dismal” enforcement on cartels. In Committee, we will scrutinise closely and challenge the Government’s proposals to ensure that our competition regime remains best in class.

The Government had a great opportunity in this Bill to deal with the consequences of their failed economic policies. The Bill was a chance to put in place legislative measures to enhance this country’s economic competitive position, and to set in train policy certainty for investors, which would allow them to invest for the long term. The Bill could have helped our companies to improve their productivity and decarbonise the economy, while allowing British firms to benefit from the green industrial revolution, which is happening now—not in 2016. It could have made a firm statement in law that failures and poor performance at the top of business would not be tolerated or rewarded with excessive pay, and it could have safeguarded consumers from powerful vested interests. The Bill has made some progress on that, but not nearly enough. It is a missed opportunity. It is a rag-bag that exposes the Government’s lack of a compelling vision and fails to help British business to compete in the global economy of today and tomorrow. On that basis, I commend the reasoned amendment to the House.

9.46 pm

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills (Norman Lamb): I have to say that I did not agree with much that the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Hartlepool (Mr Wright), said, but I do agree that it has been a good debate, with many reasoned contributions from Members on both sides of the House, which I very much welcome. I will try to address as many of the points made as I can. There will obviously be further opportunities at subsequent stages to discuss detailed points.

Contrary to what the Opposition have argued, the Bill contains important measures that will encourage long-term growth. As my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State explained in opening the debate, part of the Government’s wider strategy is to promote growth, support business and create jobs. The Government inherited a wholly unbalanced economy based very much on consumer debt and a housing bubble. It created six new regulations every working day. Those are not the actions of a business-friendly Government.

I shall deal first with the green investment bank. I am glad that Members support its creation. As my right hon. Friend made clear in his opening speech, the bank’s expertise will break new ground in the financing of green infrastructure projects, while demonstrating to the market that such investments can deliver commercial returns. The Government have made good progress in building the bank, so that it can make investments as soon as state aid approval is received. The establishment of the bank is testimony to the leadership of this Government in rebalancing the economy and putting the green agenda at the heart of that project.

The shadow Secretary of State and the hon. Members for West Bromwich West (Mr Bailey), for Stoke-on-Trent North (Joan Walley), and for Glasgow North East (Mr Bain) raised concerns about the funding, and the

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borrowing powers, of the bank. The Government have committed to the bank having £3 billion of funding up to 2015. The bank will have borrowing powers thereafter, subject to public sector debt falling—an entirely reasonable proposition. That deferred ability to borrow from 2015 will not affect the success of the green investment bank, as it first needs to focus on consolidating its expertise and developing a credible track record.

UK Green Investments has already made investments in waste infrastructure projects, and is considering major investments in priority sectors such as offshore wind. Private sector investors have responded very positively, and it is already clear that the bank will make a major contribution to the ability and willingness to invest in the green economy.

I turn now to the measures aimed at reforming the employment tribunal system. I welcome the acknowledgement by the hon. Member for Streatham (Mr Umunna) on a previous occasion that improvements can be made to the way in which the system operates, but the shadow Secretary of State today seems set against any reform and fails to recognise that other countries, including a social democrat Government in Germany, have made reforms to make their labour markets more flexible. We cannot afford to be complacent. Labour in government recognised the value of a relatively flexible labour market. Our labour market already performs well, but if we want to remain competitive, it is imperative that we are aware of what other countries are doing.

Mr Umunna rose—

Norman Lamb: As my hon. Friend the Member for Bury St Edmunds (Mr Ruffley) said, we must balance the interests of those who are in work with the interests of those who have no job and no prospects. We have to provide a mechanism to ensure that employers have the confidence to take on new employees.

Mr Umunna: Will the Minister give way?

Norman Lamb: I am afraid I do not have time. I need to get through the responses.

This Government are determined to support parties to resolve their disputes between themselves, rather than relying on a costly and time-consuming employment tribunal. A tribunal is an admission of failure and everything must be done, where practical, to prevent having to resort to it. The mediation of disputes retains employer flexibility while preserving workers’ rights and dignity, and our measures aim to encourage that further.

There has been much discussion today and in the past weeks about the proposal contained in the report prepared by Adrian Beecroft on compensated no-fault dismissal. I have made my views on the proposal very clear. This is not a measure in the Bill and therefore is not a matter on which I propose to dwell in the limited time available to me. Suffice it to say that the call for evidence has closed and my officials will be considering the responses received. I am clear, however, that we need to take action to improve the way in which businesses, especially small businesses, manage and end their relationships with employees. By addressing the fears that small businesses

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tell us they have about ending up in an employment tribunal, we can help unlock the growth that we so desperately need.

By extending the qualifying period for unfair dismissal from one to two years, we have already taken action to increase the period that employers have to decide whether a new employee is the right one for the job, but we need to provide a solution where problems occur and where the qualifying period has been exhausted.

The shadow Secretary of State asked whether any more elements of the Beecroft report would be implemented through the Bill. We do not intend to table any further amendments prompted by the recommendations in the Beecroft report.

My hon. Friend the Member for Bury St Edmunds raised the question—the case, as it were—of exemptions from employment regulations for small businesses. I am not sure whether he is in the Chamber. The evidence from Germany is that when the reform was introduced to reduce employment protection for companies of up to 10 employees, it had no impact on the number of people employed in small businesses. It therefore seems that the evidence in favour is highly questionable.

On the measures we are proposing on settlement agreements, the all-party group on micro businesses, in its response to the call for evidence on compensated no-fault dismissal, for which I am extremely grateful, supported the idea that employers should have the option of using

“a new simpler route to end employment relationships”.

The all-party group states that in return for compensation employers should

“be able to terminate a contract with an employee without going through a performance review and dismissal process. … this should be an option that is voluntary but which employers are freely able to propose to employees without fear of being taken to court.”

We agree almost entirely with that sentiment. I appreciate the comments of the hon. Member for Skipton and Ripon (Julian Smith) in the debate today. I say “almost entirely” because there is one important difference: we do not think that this option should be available only to micro-businesses. Therefore, we will table a new clause in Committee to ensure that an offer of settlement cannot be used against an employer, any employer, in an unfair dismissal case, which will give businesses the confidence to talk to their employees about bringing the relationship to a swift end through the use of a settlement agreement.

The shadow Secretary of State raised a concern about trust and confidence in the employment relationship, but he will be aware that many businesses, probably including his former clients—big companies that probably paid him substantial hourly rates—regularly use compromise agreements. We want to ensure that all businesses, including small and medium-sizes businesses, can use those agreements. If there is no agreement, the employee’s rights are still protected. They have to work together to ensure that the employment relationship is maintained.

My hon. Friend the Member for Northampton South (Mr Binley) raised concerns about SMEs. We will shortly consult on a suite of proposals to help small businesses use settlement agreements to ensure that they have the confidence to deal with employment problems. I hope that that reassures him.

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Reference was made to unfair dismissal compensatory award proposals. There has been debate about the power to amend the limit on unfair dismissal compensatory awards. The Labour party wants to make mischief on the issue, but I should point out that it is a matter of common ground that there should be a limit on the amount of the compensatory award. Having proposed removing the limit back in 1998, the then Government backtracked and elected instead to have a large, one-off increase from £12,000 to £50,000 and introduce a formula for future increases. As a result, the limit has increased rapidly in recent years and now stands at £72,300. That is greatly in excess of the median award for unfair dismissal, which is less than £5,000. Realism about potential awards is clearly important for encouraging the settlement of employment disputes and the greater use of settlement agreements.

I want to say a few words about competition. The Government believe that creating a new competition and markets authority will ensure that resources and specialised competition expertise can be deployed to best effect while reducing the burdens on business, and I was pleased that the shadow Secretary of State supported that principle. This matters for the taxpayer and for businesses and consumers at the wrong end of anti-competitive practices. The Government recognise that a great strength of the current regime is the two-phase approach to markets and merger cases and wish to preserve it. We will therefore retain the separation of decision making; the board will have responsibility for the initial investigation and phase-1 decisions, and groups of independent panellists will continue to make final decisions at phase 2. When making those decisions, the groups will be required to act independently of the board, which will ensure that decisions are robust by giving cases a second look and bringing in the use of experienced business people and other outside experts. There will also be scrutiny by the Competition Appeal Tribunal.

The Bill is pro-growth and pro-business. We have listened to small and large businesses across the country, the businesses on which this country’s recovery depends. They have told us that fair and speedy ways of resolving disputes matter to them. We have listened and are delivering the measures that matter to them. A strong and effective competition regime matters for business. Reducing the excessive burden of regulation, much of which was introduced under the previous Administration, and the cost of compliance with regulation matters for business. The Bill will help businesses to grow and succeed. It will boost consumer and business confidence and help the private sector create jobs. It will promote fairness and support our green economy. I commend it to the House.

Question put, That the amendment be made.

The House divided:

Ayes 216, Noes 301.

Division No. 13]

[9.59 pm

AYES

Abbott, Ms Diane

Abrahams, Debbie

Alexander, Heidi

Ali, Rushanara

Allen, Mr Graham

Anderson, Mr David

Austin, Ian

Bailey, Mr Adrian

Bain, Mr William

Balls, rh Ed

Banks, Gordon

Barron, rh Mr Kevin

Beckett, rh Margaret

Bell, Sir Stuart

Benn, rh Hilary

Benton, Mr Joe

Berger, Luciana

Betts, Mr Clive

Blenkinsop, Tom

Blomfield, Paul

Blunkett, rh Mr David

Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben

Brennan, Kevin

Brown, Lyn

Brown, rh Mr Nicholas

Brown, Mr Russell

Bryant, Chris

Buck, Ms Karen

Burden, Richard

Burnham, rh Andy

Byrne, rh Mr Liam

Campbell, Mr Alan

Campbell, Mr Ronnie

Caton, Martin

Chapman, Mrs Jenny

Clark, Katy

Clarke, rh Mr Tom

Clwyd, rh Ann

Coaker, Vernon

Coffey, Ann

Cooper, Rosie

Cooper, rh Yvette

Corbyn, Jeremy

Crausby, Mr David

Creasy, Stella

Cruddas, Jon

Cryer, John

Cunningham, Alex

Cunningham, Mr Jim

Cunningham, Tony

Curran, Margaret

Danczuk, Simon

Darling, rh Mr Alistair

David, Mr Wayne

Davidson, Mr Ian

Davies, Geraint

De Piero, Gloria

Denham, rh Mr John

Dobbin, Jim

Dobson, rh Frank

Donohoe, Mr Brian H.

Doran, Mr Frank

Dowd, Jim

Doyle, Gemma

Dromey, Jack

Dugher, Michael

Durkan, Mark

Eagle, Ms Angela

Eagle, Maria

Edwards, Jonathan

Efford, Clive

Ellman, Mrs Louise

Engel, Natascha

Esterson, Bill

Evans, Chris

Farrelly, Paul

Field, rh Mr Frank

Fitzpatrick, Jim

Flello, Robert

Flint, rh Caroline

Flynn, Paul

Francis, Dr Hywel

Gilmore, Sheila

Glass, Pat

Glindon, Mrs Mary

Godsiff, Mr Roger

Goggins, rh Paul

Goodman, Helen

Green, Kate

Greenwood, Lilian

Griffith, Nia

Gwynne, Andrew

Hain, rh Mr Peter

Hamilton, Mr David

Hamilton, Fabian

Hanson, rh Mr David

Harman, rh Ms Harriet

Harris, Mr Tom

Havard, Mr Dai

Healey, rh John

Hepburn, Mr Stephen

Heyes, David

Hillier, Meg

Hilling, Julie

Hodge, rh Margaret

Hodgson, Mrs Sharon

Hoey, Kate

Howarth, rh Mr George

Hunt, Tristram

Irranca-Davies, Huw

Jackson, Glenda

Jamieson, Cathy

Jarvis, Dan

Johnson, rh Alan

Johnson, Diana

Jones, Graham

Jones, Helen

Jones, Mr Kevan

Jones, Susan Elan

Joyce, Eric

Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald

Keeley, Barbara

Kendall, Liz

Lammy, rh Mr David

Lavery, Ian

Leslie, Chris

Lewis, Mr Ivan

Lloyd, Tony

Love, Mr Andrew

Lucas, Caroline

Lucas, Ian

Mactaggart, Fiona

Mahmood, Shabana

Malhotra, Seema

Mann, John

Marsden, Mr Gordon

McCann, Mr Michael

McClymont, Gregg

McCrea, Dr William

McDonagh, Siobhain

McDonnell, John

McFadden, rh Mr Pat

McGovern, Jim

McGuire, rh Mrs Anne

McKechin, Ann

McKenzie, Mr Iain

McKinnell, Catherine

Meacher, rh Mr Michael

Meale, Sir Alan

Mearns, Ian

Michael, rh Alun

Miliband, rh David

Mitchell, Austin

Moon, Mrs Madeleine

Morden, Jessica

Morrice, Graeme

(Livingston)

Morris, Grahame M.

(Easington)

Mudie, Mr George

Murphy, rh Paul

Murray, Ian

Nandy, Lisa

Nash, Pamela

O'Donnell, Fiona

Onwurah, Chi

Osborne, Sandra

Owen, Albert

Pearce, Teresa

Perkins, Toby

Phillipson, Bridget

Pound, Stephen

Qureshi, Yasmin

Raynsford, rh Mr Nick

Reed, Mr Jamie

Reeves, Rachel

Reynolds, Emma

Reynolds, Jonathan

Ritchie, Ms Margaret

Robertson, John

Robinson, Mr Geoffrey

Rotheram, Steve

Roy, Mr Frank

Roy, Lindsay

Ruane, Chris

Ruddock, rh Dame Joan

Seabeck, Alison

Sheerman, Mr Barry

Shuker, Gavin

Simpson, David

Skinner, Mr Dennis

Slaughter, Mr Andy

Smith, rh Mr Andrew

Smith, Nick

Smith, Owen

Spellar, rh Mr John

Straw, rh Mr Jack

Stringer, Graham

Stuart, Ms Gisela

Tami, Mark

Timms, rh Stephen

Trickett, Jon

Turner, Karl

Twigg, Derek

Twigg, Stephen

Umunna, Mr Chuka

Vaz, rh Keith

Walley, Joan

Watts, Mr Dave

Whitehead, Dr Alan

Williamson, Chris

Wilson, Phil

Winnick, Mr David

Winterton, rh Ms Rosie

Woodcock, John

Woodward, rh Mr Shaun

Wright, David

Wright, Mr Iain

Tellers for the Ayes:

Jonathan Ashworth and

Nic Dakin

NOES

Adams, Nigel

Afriyie, Adam

Aldous, Peter

Amess, Mr David

Andrew, Stuart

Arbuthnot, rh Mr James

Bacon, Mr Richard

Baker, Norman

Baker, Steve

Baldry, Tony

Baldwin, Harriett

Barclay, Stephen

Barker, Gregory

Baron, Mr John

Barwell, Gavin

Bebb, Guto

Beresford, Sir Paul

Berry, Jake

Bingham, Andrew

Binley, Mr Brian

Birtwistle, Gordon

Blackman, Bob

Blackwood, Nicola

Boles, Nick

Bone, Mr Peter

Bottomley, Sir Peter

Bradley, Karen

Brake, rh Tom

Bray, Angie

Brazier, Mr Julian

Bridgen, Andrew

Brine, Steve

Bruce, Fiona

Bruce, rh Malcolm

Buckland, Mr Robert

Burley, Mr Aidan

Burns, rh Mr Simon

Burrowes, Mr David

Burstow, Paul

Byles, Dan

Cable, rh Vince

Campbell, rh Sir Menzies

Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair

Carmichael, Neil

Carswell, Mr Douglas

Chope, Mr Christopher

Clark, rh Greg

Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth

Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey

Coffey, Dr Thérèse

Collins, Damian

Colvile, Oliver

Cox, Mr Geoffrey

Crabb, Stephen

Crockart, Mike

Crouch, Tracey

Davies, Glyn

Davies, Philip

Davis, rh Mr David

de Bois, Nick

Djanogly, Mr Jonathan

Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen

Dorries, Nadine

Doyle-Price, Jackie

Drax, Richard

Duddridge, James

Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain

Ellis, Michael

Ellison, Jane

Elphicke, Charlie

Eustice, George

Evans, Graham

Evans, Jonathan

Evennett, Mr David

Fabricant, Michael

Fallon, Michael

Farron, Tim

Featherstone, Lynne

Field, Mark

Foster, rh Mr Don

Fox, rh Dr Liam

Francois, rh Mr Mark

Freeman, George

Freer, Mike

Fullbrook, Lorraine

Fuller, Richard

Gale, Sir Roger

Garnier, Mr Edward

Garnier, Mark

Gauke, Mr David

George, Andrew

Gibb, Mr Nick

Gilbert, Stephen

Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl

Glen, John

Goldsmith, Zac

Goodwill, Mr Robert

Graham, Richard

Grant, Mrs Helen

Gray, Mr James

Grayling, rh Chris

Green, Damian

Greening, rh Justine

Grieve, rh Mr Dominic

Griffiths, Andrew

Gummer, Ben

Gyimah, Mr Sam

Halfon, Robert

Hames, Duncan

Hammond, rh Mr Philip

Hammond, Stephen

Hancock, Matthew

Hancock, Mr Mike

Hands, Greg

Harper, Mr Mark

Harrington, Richard

Harris, Rebecca

Hart, Simon

Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan

Hayes, Mr John

Heald, Oliver

Heath, Mr David

Heaton-Harris, Chris

Hemming, John

Henderson, Gordon

Hendry, Charles

Herbert, rh Nick

Hinds, Damian

Hoban, Mr Mark

Hollingbery, George

Hollobone, Mr Philip

Hopkins, Kris

Horwood, Martin

Howarth, Mr Gerald

Howell, John

Hughes, rh Simon

Huhne, rh Chris

Hunt, rh Mr Jeremy

Huppert, Dr Julian

Jackson, Mr Stewart

James, Margot

Javid, Sajid

Jenkin, Mr Bernard

Johnson, Gareth

Johnson, Joseph

Jones, Andrew

Jones, Mr David

Jones, Mr Marcus

Kawczynski, Daniel

Kelly, Chris

Kirby, Simon

Knight, rh Mr Greg

Kwarteng, Kwasi

Lamb, Norman

Lancaster, Mark

Lansley, rh Mr Andrew

Latham, Pauline

Laws, rh Mr David

Leadsom, Andrea

Lee, Jessica

Lee, Dr Phillip

Leech, Mr John

Lefroy, Jeremy

Leigh, Mr Edward

Lewis, Brandon

Lewis, Dr Julian

Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian

Lidington, rh Mr David

Lloyd, Stephen

Lord, Jonathan

Loughton, Tim

Luff, Peter

Lumley, Karen

Main, Mrs Anne

Maude, rh Mr Francis

Maynard, Paul

McCartney, Jason

McCartney, Karl

McIntosh, Miss Anne

McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick

McPartland, Stephen

McVey, Esther

Mensch, Louise

Menzies, Mark

Mercer, Patrick

Miller, Maria

Mills, Nigel

Milton, Anne

Mitchell, rh Mr Andrew

Moore, rh Michael

Mordaunt, Penny

Morgan, Nicky

Morris, Anne Marie

Morris, David

Morris, James

Mosley, Stephen

Mowat, David

Mulholland, Greg

Mundell, rh David

Munt, Tessa

Murray, Sheryll

Murrison, Dr Andrew

Neill, Robert

Newmark, Mr Brooks

Nokes, Caroline

Norman, Jesse

Nuttall, Mr David

O'Brien, Mr Stephen

Offord, Mr Matthew

Ollerenshaw, Eric

Opperman, Guy

Ottaway, Richard

Paice, rh Mr James

Parish, Neil

Patel, Priti

Pawsey, Mark

Penning, Mike

Penrose, John

Phillips, Stephen

Pickles, rh Mr Eric

Pincher, Christopher

Poulter, Dr Daniel

Prisk, Mr Mark

Pugh, John

Raab, Mr Dominic

Randall, rh Mr John

Reckless, Mark

Redwood, rh Mr John

Rees-Mogg, Jacob

Reevell, Simon

Reid, Mr Alan

Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm

Robertson, Hugh

Robertson, Mr Laurence

Rogerson, Dan

Rosindell, Andrew

Rudd, Amber

Ruffley, Mr David

Russell, Sir Bob

Rutley, David

Sanders, Mr Adrian

Sandys, Laura

Scott, Mr Lee

Selous, Andrew

Shapps, rh Grant

Sharma, Alok

Shelbrooke, Alec

Simmonds, Mark

Skidmore, Chris

Smith, Miss Chloe

Smith, Julian

Soames, rh Nicholas

Soubry, Anna

Spencer, Mr Mark

Stanley, rh Sir John

Stephenson, Andrew

Stevenson, John

Stewart, Iain

Stewart, Rory

Streeter, Mr Gary

Stride, Mel

Stuart, Mr Graham

Stunell, Andrew

Sturdy, Julian

Swales, Ian

Swinson, Jo

Swire, rh Mr Hugo

Syms, Mr Robert

Teather, Sarah

Thurso, John

Timpson, Mr Edward

Truss, Elizabeth

Turner, Mr Andrew

Tyrie, Mr Andrew

Uppal, Paul

Vara, Mr Shailesh

Vickers, Martin

Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa

Walker, Mr Charles

Walker, Mr Robin

Ward, Mr David

Watkinson, Angela

Weatherley, Mike

Webb, Steve

Wharton, James

Wheeler, Heather

White, Chris

Whittaker, Craig

Whittingdale, Mr John

Wiggin, Bill

Willetts, rh Mr David

Williamson, Gavin

Willott, Jenny

Wilson, Mr Rob

Wollaston, Dr Sarah

Wright, Jeremy

Wright, Simon

Yeo, Mr Tim

Young, rh Sir George

Zahawi, Nadhim

Tellers for the Noes:

Mr Philip Dunne and

Mark Hunter

Question accordingly negatived.

11 Jun 2012 : Column 134

11 Jun 2012 : Column 135

11 Jun 2012 : Column 136

11 Jun 2012 : Column 137

Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 62(2)), That the Bill be now read a Second time.

Question agreed to.

Bill accordingly read a Second time.

ENTERPRISE AND REGULATORY REFORM BILL (PROGRAMME)

Motion made, and Question put forthwith, (Standing Order No. 83A(7)),

That the following provisions shall apply to the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill:

Committal

1. The Bill shall be committed to a Public Bill Committee.

Proceedings in Public Bill Committee

2. Proceedings in the Public Bill Committee shall (so far as not previously concluded) be brought to a conclusion on Tuesday 17 July 2012.

3. The Public Bill Committee shall have leave to sit twice on the first day on which it meets.

Consideration and Third Reading

4. Proceedings on Consideration shall (so far as not previously concluded) be brought to a conclusion one hour before the moment of interruption on the day on which those proceedings are commenced.

11 Jun 2012 : Column 138

5. Proceedings on Third Reading shall (so far as not previously concluded) be brought to a conclusion at the moment of interruption on that day.

6. Standing Order No. 83B (Programming committees) shall not apply to proceedings on Consideration and Third Reading.

Other proceedings

7. Any other proceedings on the Bill (including any proceedings on consideration of Lords Amendments or on any further messages from the Lords) may be programmed.—(Angela Watkinson.)

The House divided:

Ayes 301, Noes 213.

Division No. 14]

[10.16 pm

AYES

Adams, Nigel

Afriyie, Adam

Aldous, Peter

Amess, Mr David

Andrew, Stuart

Arbuthnot, rh Mr James

Bacon, Mr Richard

Baker, Norman

Baker, Steve

Baldry, Tony

Baldwin, Harriett

Barclay, Stephen

Barker, Gregory

Baron, Mr John

Barwell, Gavin

Bebb, Guto

Beresford, Sir Paul

Berry, Jake

Bingham, Andrew

Binley, Mr Brian

Birtwistle, Gordon

Blackman, Bob

Blackwood, Nicola

Boles, Nick

Bone, Mr Peter

Bottomley, Sir Peter

Bradley, Karen

Brake, rh Tom

Bray, Angie

Brazier, Mr Julian

Bridgen, Andrew

Brine, Steve

Bruce, Fiona

Bruce, rh Malcolm

Buckland, Mr Robert

Burley, Mr Aidan

Burns, rh Mr Simon

Burrowes, Mr David

Burstow, Paul

Byles, Dan

Cable, rh Vince

Campbell, rh Sir Menzies

Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair

Carmichael, Neil

Carswell, Mr Douglas

Chope, Mr Christopher

Clark, rh Greg

Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth

Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey

Coffey, Dr Thérèse

Collins, Damian

Colvile, Oliver

Cox, Mr Geoffrey

Crabb, Stephen

Crockart, Mike

Crouch, Tracey

Davies, Glyn

Davies, Philip

Davis, rh Mr David

de Bois, Nick

Djanogly, Mr Jonathan

Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen

Dorries, Nadine

Doyle-Price, Jackie

Drax, Richard

Duddridge, James

Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain

Dunne, Mr Philip

Ellis, Michael

Ellison, Jane

Elphicke, Charlie

Eustice, George

Evans, Graham

Evans, Jonathan

Evennett, Mr David

Fabricant, Michael

Fallon, Michael

Farron, Tim

Featherstone, Lynne

Field, Mark

Foster, rh Mr Don

Fox, rh Dr Liam

Francois, rh Mr Mark

Freeman, George

Freer, Mike

Fullbrook, Lorraine

Fuller, Richard

Gale, Sir Roger

Garnier, Mr Edward

Garnier, Mark

Gauke, Mr David

George, Andrew

Gibb, Mr Nick

Gilbert, Stephen

Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl

Glen, John

Goldsmith, Zac

Goodwill, Mr Robert

Graham, Richard

Grant, Mrs Helen

Gray, Mr James

Grayling, rh Chris

Green, Damian

Greening, rh Justine

Grieve, rh Mr Dominic

Griffiths, Andrew

Gummer, Ben

Gyimah, Mr Sam

Halfon, Robert

Hames, Duncan

Hammond, rh Mr Philip

Hammond, Stephen

Hancock, Matthew

Hancock, Mr Mike

Harper, Mr Mark

Harrington, Richard

Harris, Rebecca

Hart, Simon

Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan

Hayes, Mr John

Heald, Oliver

Heath, Mr David

Heaton-Harris, Chris

Hemming, John

Henderson, Gordon

Hendry, Charles

Herbert, rh Nick

Hinds, Damian

Hoban, Mr Mark

Hollingbery, George

Hollobone, Mr Philip

Hopkins, Kris

Horwood, Martin

Howarth, Mr Gerald

Howell, John

Hughes, rh Simon

Huhne, rh Chris

Hunt, rh Mr Jeremy

Huppert, Dr Julian

Jackson, Mr Stewart

James, Margot

Javid, Sajid

Jenkin, Mr Bernard

Johnson, Gareth

Johnson, Joseph

Jones, Andrew

Jones, Mr David

Jones, Mr Marcus

Kawczynski, Daniel

Kelly, Chris

Kirby, Simon

Knight, rh Mr Greg

Kwarteng, Kwasi

Lamb, Norman

Lancaster, Mark

Lansley, rh Mr Andrew

Latham, Pauline

Laws, rh Mr David

Leadsom, Andrea

Lee, Jessica

Lee, Dr Phillip

Leech, Mr John

Lefroy, Jeremy

Lewis, Brandon

Lewis, Dr Julian

Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian

Lidington, rh Mr David

Lilley, rh Mr Peter

Lloyd, Stephen

Lord, Jonathan

Loughton, Tim

Luff, Peter

Lumley, Karen

Macleod, Mary

Main, Mrs Anne

Maude, rh Mr Francis

Maynard, Paul

McCartney, Jason

McCartney, Karl

McCrea, Dr William

McIntosh, Miss Anne

McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick

McPartland, Stephen

McVey, Esther

Mensch, Louise

Menzies, Mark

Mercer, Patrick

Miller, Maria

Mills, Nigel

Milton, Anne

Mitchell, rh Mr Andrew

Moore, rh Michael

Mordaunt, Penny

Morgan, Nicky

Morris, Anne Marie

Morris, David

Morris, James

Mosley, Stephen

Mowat, David

Mulholland, Greg

Mundell, rh David

Munt, Tessa

Murray, Sheryll

Murrison, Dr Andrew

Newmark, Mr Brooks

Nokes, Caroline

Norman, Jesse

Nuttall, Mr David

O'Brien, Mr Stephen

Offord, Mr Matthew

Ollerenshaw, Eric

Opperman, Guy

Ottaway, Richard

Paice, rh Mr James

Parish, Neil

Patel, Priti

Pawsey, Mark

Penning, Mike

Penrose, John

Phillips, Stephen

Pickles, rh Mr Eric

Pincher, Christopher

Poulter, Dr Daniel

Prisk, Mr Mark

Pugh, John

Raab, Mr Dominic

Randall, rh Mr John

Reckless, Mark

Redwood, rh Mr John

Rees-Mogg, Jacob

Reevell, Simon

Reid, Mr Alan

Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm

Robertson, Hugh

Robertson, Mr Laurence

Rogerson, Dan

Rosindell, Andrew

Rudd, Amber

Ruffley, Mr David

Russell, Sir Bob

Rutley, David

Sanders, Mr Adrian

Sandys, Laura

Scott, Mr Lee

Selous, Andrew

Shapps, rh Grant

Sharma, Alok

Shelbrooke, Alec

Simmonds, Mark

Simpson, David

Skidmore, Chris

Smith, Miss Chloe

Smith, Julian

Soames, rh Nicholas

Soubry, Anna

Spencer, Mr Mark

Stephenson, Andrew

Stevenson, John

Stewart, Iain

Stewart, Rory

Streeter, Mr Gary

Stride, Mel

Stuart, Mr Graham

Stunell, Andrew

Sturdy, Julian

Swales, Ian

Swinson, Jo

Swire, rh Mr Hugo

Syms, Mr Robert

Teather, Sarah

Thurso, John

Timpson, Mr Edward

Truss, Elizabeth

Turner, Mr Andrew

Tyrie, Mr Andrew

Uppal, Paul

Vara, Mr Shailesh

Vickers, Martin

Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa

Walker, Mr Charles

Walker, Mr Robin

Ward, Mr David

Watkinson, Angela

Weatherley, Mike

Webb, Steve

Wharton, James

Wheeler, Heather

White, Chris

Whittaker, Craig

Whittingdale, Mr John

Wiggin, Bill

Willetts, rh Mr David

Williamson, Gavin

Willott, Jenny

Wilson, Mr Rob

Wollaston, Dr Sarah

Wright, Jeremy

Wright, Simon

Yeo, Mr Tim

Young, rh Sir George

Zahawi, Nadhim

Tellers for the Ayes:

Greg Hands and

Mark Hunter

NOES

Abbott, Ms Diane

Abrahams, Debbie

Alexander, Heidi

Ali, Rushanara

Allen, Mr Graham

Anderson, Mr David

Austin, Ian

Bailey, Mr Adrian

Bain, Mr William

Balls, rh Ed

Banks, Gordon

Barron, rh Mr Kevin

Beckett, rh Margaret

Bell, Sir Stuart

Benn, rh Hilary

Benton, Mr Joe

Berger, Luciana

Betts, Mr Clive

Blenkinsop, Tom

Blomfield, Paul

Blunkett, rh Mr David

Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben

Brennan, Kevin

Brown, Lyn

Brown, rh Mr Nicholas

Brown, Mr Russell

Bryant, Chris

Buck, Ms Karen

Burden, Richard

Burnham, rh Andy

Byrne, rh Mr Liam

Campbell, Mr Alan

Campbell, Mr Ronnie

Caton, Martin

Chapman, Mrs Jenny

Clark, Katy

Clarke, rh Mr Tom

Clwyd, rh Ann

Coaker, Vernon

Coffey, Ann

Cooper, Rosie

Cooper, rh Yvette

Corbyn, Jeremy

Crausby, Mr David

Creasy, Stella

Cruddas, Jon

Cryer, John

Cunningham, Alex

Cunningham, Mr Jim

Cunningham, Tony

Curran, Margaret

Danczuk, Simon

Darling, rh Mr Alistair

David, Mr Wayne

Davidson, Mr Ian

Davies, Geraint

De Piero, Gloria

Denham, rh Mr John

Dobbin, Jim

Dobson, rh Frank

Donohoe, Mr Brian H.

Doran, Mr Frank

Dowd, Jim

Doyle, Gemma

Dromey, Jack

Dugher, Michael

Durkan, Mark

Eagle, Ms Angela

Eagle, Maria

Edwards, Jonathan

Efford, Clive

Ellman, Mrs Louise

Engel, Natascha

Esterson, Bill

Evans, Chris

Farrelly, Paul

Field, rh Mr Frank

Fitzpatrick, Jim

Flello, Robert

Flint, rh Caroline

Flynn, Paul

Francis, Dr Hywel

Gilmore, Sheila

Glass, Pat

Glindon, Mrs Mary

Godsiff, Mr Roger

Goggins, rh Paul

Goodman, Helen

Green, Kate

Greenwood, Lilian

Griffith, Nia

Gwynne, Andrew

Hain, rh Mr Peter

Hamilton, Mr David

Hamilton, Fabian

Hanson, rh Mr David

Harman, rh Ms Harriet

Harris, Mr Tom

Havard, Mr Dai

Healey, rh John

Hepburn, Mr Stephen

Heyes, David

Hillier, Meg

Hilling, Julie

Hodge, rh Margaret

Hodgson, Mrs Sharon

Hoey, Kate

Howarth, rh Mr George

Hunt, Tristram

Irranca-Davies, Huw

Jackson, Glenda

Jamieson, Cathy

Jarvis, Dan

Johnson, rh Alan

Johnson, Diana

Jones, Graham

Jones, Helen

Jones, Mr Kevan

Jones, Susan Elan

Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald

Keeley, Barbara

Kendall, Liz

Lammy, rh Mr David

Lavery, Ian

Leslie, Chris

Lewis, Mr Ivan

Lloyd, Tony

Love, Mr Andrew

Lucas, Caroline

Lucas, Ian

Mactaggart, Fiona

Mahmood, Shabana

Malhotra, Seema

Mann, John

Marsden, Mr Gordon

McCann, Mr Michael

McClymont, Gregg

McDonagh, Siobhain

McDonnell, John

McFadden, rh Mr Pat

McGovern, Jim

McGuire, rh Mrs Anne

McKechin, Ann

McKenzie, Mr Iain

McKinnell, Catherine

Meacher, rh Mr Michael

Meale, Sir Alan

Mearns, Ian

Michael, rh Alun

Miliband, rh David

Moon, Mrs Madeleine

Morden, Jessica

Morrice, Graeme

(Livingston)

Morris, Grahame M.

(Easington)

Mudie, Mr George

Murphy, rh Paul

Murray, Ian

Nandy, Lisa

Nash, Pamela

O'Donnell, Fiona

Onwurah, Chi

Osborne, Sandra

Owen, Albert

Pearce, Teresa

Perkins, Toby

Phillipson, Bridget

Pound, Stephen

Qureshi, Yasmin

Raynsford, rh Mr Nick

Reed, Mr Jamie

Reeves, Rachel

Reynolds, Emma

Reynolds, Jonathan

Ritchie, Ms Margaret

Robertson, John

Robinson, Mr Geoffrey

Rotheram, Steve

Roy, Mr Frank

Roy, Lindsay

Ruane, Chris

Ruddock, rh Dame Joan

Seabeck, Alison

Sheerman, Mr Barry

Shuker, Gavin

Skinner, Mr Dennis

Slaughter, Mr Andy

Smith, rh Mr Andrew

Smith, Nick

Smith, Owen

Spellar, rh Mr John

Straw, rh Mr Jack

Stringer, Graham

Stuart, Ms Gisela

Tami, Mark

Timms, rh Stephen

Trickett, Jon

Turner, Karl

Twigg, Derek

Twigg, Stephen

Umunna, Mr Chuka

Vaz, rh Keith

Walley, Joan

Watts, Mr Dave

Whiteford, Dr Eilidh

Whitehead, Dr Alan

Williamson, Chris

Wilson, Phil

Winnick, Mr David

Winterton, rh Ms Rosie

Woodcock, John

Woodward, rh Mr Shaun

Wright, David

Wright, Mr Iain

Tellers for the Noes:

Nic Dakin and

Jonathan Ashworth

Question accordingly agreed to.

11 Jun 2012 : Column 139

11 Jun 2012 : Column 140

11 Jun 2012 : Column 141

11 Jun 2012 : Column 142

Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill (Money)

Queen’s recommendation signified.

Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 52(1)(a)),

That, for the purposes of any Act resulting from the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill, it is expedient to authorise—

(1) the payment out of money provided by Parliament of any expenditure incurred under or by virtue of the Act by the Secretary of State or the Competition and Markets Authority;

(2) the payment out of the National Loans Fund of any sums payable out of the Fund by virtue of the Act;

(3) any increase attributable to the Act in the sums payable under any other Act out of money provided by Parliament.—(Angela Watkinson.)

Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill (Ways and Means)

Queen’s recommendation signified.

Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 52(1)(a)),

That, for the purposes of any Act resulting from the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill, it is expedient to authorise the payment of sums into the Consolidated Fund. —(Angela Watkinson.)

Business without Debate

Delegated Legislation

Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 118(6)),

Pensions

That the draft Automatic Enrolment (Earnings Trigger and Qualifying Earnings Band) Order 2012, which was laid before this House on 26 March 2012, in the previous Session of Parliament, be approved.—(Angela Watkinson.)

Question agreed to.

Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 118(6)),

National Health Service

That the draft Health and Social Care Act 2008 (Regulated Activities) (Amendment) Regulations 2012, which were laid before this House on 27 March 2012, in the previous Session of Parliament, be approved.—(Angela Watkinson.)

Question agreed to.

Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 118(6)),

London Government

That the draft Greater London Authority Act 1999 (Amendment) Order 2012, which was laid before this House on 19 March 2012, in the previous Session of Parliament, be approved.—(Angela Watkinson.)

Question agreed to.

Backbench Business Committee

Motion made,

That Mr David Amess, Mr David Anderson, Bob Blackman, Jane Ellison, John Hemming, Mr Marcus Jones and Ian Mearns be members of the Backbench Business Committee.—(Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, on behalf of the Committee of Selection.)

11 Jun 2012 : Column 143

Hon. Members: Object.

Mr Speaker: We are all struck by the speed with which the hon. Member for Christchurch (Mr Chope) has registered his objection.

Education

Ordered,

That Tessa Munt be discharged from the Education Committee and Mr David Ward be added.—(Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, on behalf of the Committee of Selection.)

Science and Technology

Ordered,

That Jonathan Reynolds be discharged from the Science and Technology Committee and Jim Dowd be added..—(Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, on behalf of the Committee of Selection.)

11 Jun 2012 : Column 144

Dementia Services (South-West)

Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House do now adjourn.—(Angela Watkinson.)

Mr Speaker: Before I call the right hon. Member for Exeter (Mr Bradshaw), perhaps I could appeal to Members who are leaving the Chamber—unaccountably not wishing to remain to hear the right hon. Gentleman’s speech—to do so quickly and quietly, affording the same courtesy to the right hon. Gentleman that they would want to be extended to them.

10.33 pm

Mr Ben Bradshaw (Exeter) (Lab): Thank you very much, Mr Speaker—and thank you very much for granting a debate on a subject that is of great concern to my constituents in Exeter, to people throughout the south-west, and, indeed, to people throughout the country. My own mother suffered from dementia, and died very young when I was just 18. That was in the days when Alzheimer’s and other dementias were only just beginning to be recognised. Since then we have made great strides in terms of our knowledge and understanding, and the treatment that is available to sufferers and their families. I pay particular tribute to the Alzheimer’s Society for its campaigning work and the support that it provides for people.

There are currently 800,000 people with dementia in the United Kingdom, and one in three of us will have it by the end of our lives, so this is an issue that touches, or will touch, virtually every household and every family in our country. Although progress has been made, there are still big gaps and unacceptable variations in levels of service and support, and I shall focus on three issues that cause particular concern: the rates of diagnosis; the availability of drugs for sufferers; and the overall resilience of the care system, on which many dementia sufferers and their families depend.

Everybody—including, I am pleased to say, the Government—accepts that early diagnosis is absolutely vital in ensuring that people with dementia and their families receive the information, treatment and support they need. At present, however, fewer than half—43%—of dementia sufferers have a formal diagnosis, and in the south-west that rate is even lower; in fact, my region has the lowest diagnosis rate of anywhere in England at just 35.4%, with my own county, Devon, having barely a third of sufferers diagnosed and Dorset having the lowest rate in the country at just 27%. As the south-west of England has a higher than average proportion of elderly people, and therefore more dementia sufferers, that is extremely worrying. Indeed, according to the Minister’s own figures, in Devon alone there are almost 9,000 people with dementia who have not been diagnosed. In contrast, average diagnosis rates across Northern Ireland are above 60%, and in Belfast the rate is almost 70%. What is the Minister’s explanation for this huge variation in diagnosis rates across the country, and what are his Government doing to address that?

Many fear that the Government’s upheaval of the NHS might make this situation even worse, not better. Putting GPs in the driving seat means that the level of awareness and understanding of the problem among GPs will be more important than ever. GP training is therefore vital, and I welcome the progress that is being made, such as in Devon, where an education programme

11 Jun 2012 : Column 145

for GPs has reached 374 practices across our county, and there are already signs of increased diagnosis rates. But education alone is not enough. GPs need to have access to help and support, but the key to improving diagnosis rates in the south-west will be to ensure that GPs can refer patients to memory services for diagnosis. I have heard reports of people waiting over a year for an appointment at a memory clinic, however.

As the Minister will be aware, the Alzheimer’s Society recently wrote to all MPs asking us to write to our local primary care trusts in order to establish waiting times at memory services in their areas. I commend this initiative. Will the Minister say whether the Department of Health collects data on waiting times at memory services in the south-west—as well as in other regions? If not, will he arrange for NHS South of England to provide Members with this information?

The Royal College of Psychiatrists has established the memory services national accreditation programme, to ensure that services at memory clinics meet national standards. Does the Minister agree that all memory services should seek such national accreditation and that that should be a priority for local NHS managers?

As the Minister will also be aware, next month the all-party group on dementia will report on its inquiry into improving diagnosis rates. I understand that he has been invited to the launch of the report, and I hope he can confirm tonight that he will be able to attend.

The second issue I want to highlight is the variation in the availability of medicines for dementia sufferers. These medicines can make an enormous difference both to the progression of the illness and the quality of life enjoyed by the sufferer and their carers. The Minister will be aware of the massive—some reports have suggested as much as 50-fold—variation in the level of drug prescribing among PCTs in England. Again, the south-west does very poorly. We are not the lowest region in England in respect of prescribing, but we rank as the second lowest region after the west midlands. It is very worrying that our region, with its high proportion of elderly people and therefore of dementia sufferers, has the second lowest level of availability of medicines that could help them. Will the Minister explain the reasons for that, what the Government are doing about it, and how he can guarantee that this problem will not get worse under the Government’s reorganisation of the health service?

The third and final concern I wish to raise tonight is the financial hardship faced by dementia sufferers and their families because of the cost of long-term care. We know that, in some cases, that can run into hundreds of thousands of pounds; it can lead to families losing their homes or their inheritance because of the lottery of getting dementia. Many people rightly feel that that is deeply unfair. In my view, the long-awaited report by Andrew Dilnot on the future of long-term care provides a sustainable and equitable solution to that deep unfairness that some families face and to the general challenge of providing long-term care.

Alison Seabeck (Plymouth, Moor View) (Lab): This is an incredibly important debate and my right hon. Friend has touched on a number of issues that affect my constituents. In a recent case, the mother of Lee Finn was in Derriford hospital with dementia; the family came in and read her chart—they had power of attorney—

11 Jun 2012 : Column 146

and saw that it said “Do not resuscitate”. The family had not been asked or consulted in any way. Does my right hon. Friend share my concern that, although there is some fantastic work going on in the field of dementia, crass errors continue to be made that cause families deep unhappiness? It is clearly not good for the dementia sufferers if the whole family is destabilised because of poor decision making.

Mr Bradshaw: I agree absolutely. As I said, and as I hope the Minister will endorse, training and awareness of dementia are vital not only in primary care settings but in secondary care settings, as in the case my hon. Friend raises. Some people who may seem to be extremely ill with dementia and who are in the situation she describes may in fact be physically perfectly fit and able to carry on living for some time. I hope that her local hospital will take up the case and provide a satisfactory response.

As I was saying, there is a strong feeling on both sides of the House that we need a sustainable and fair solution to the challenge of long-term care. That challenge particularly, but not solely, affects families with members who suffer from dementia because of the enormous costs imposed on them by having to pay for long-term care. I do not think it an exaggeration to say that there was great disappointment when the Queen’s Speech again failed to include a Bill to implement the Dilnot proposals. As far as it goes, the Government’s commitment to a draft Bill was welcome, but it would be helpful if the Minister told us when that draft is likely to be published and guaranteed that a Bill will be passed in this Parliament. May I boldly suggest that that would be a real legacy and worth working for?

Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): Does my right hon. Friend agree that part of the reason people are not diagnosed is the great fear of what dementia means? In fact, if we provided good care in their own homes, they could stay there longer before needing to go into residential care. We should look not only at the cost of residential care, but at the cost of home care and reach a settlement on that, too.

Mr Bradshaw: My hon. Friend is absolutely right and makes an important point.

I would be grateful if the Minister also gave a commitment that the Bill, when it comes to the House, will address the postcode lottery in the availability and quality of services. Tower Hamlets in London, for example, spends five times as much on dementia services as Cornwall in the south-west, which is the lowest spending authority in the country. That simply cannot be right.

The urgency of meeting the challenge of long-term care is all the greater as figures uncovered by my hon. Friend the Member for Leicester West (Liz Kendall) show that pressure on local authority budgets is already leading councils to increase their charges and tighten their eligibility criteria, so that many people are losing the assistance they previously received. The situation is getting worse and will continue to do so until the Government grasp the nettle of long-term care and implement the Dilnot report.

At any one time, one in four hospital beds is taken up by people with dementia. Delayed discharges from hospital and unnecessary admissions to hospital cost every hospital

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in the south-west hundreds of thousands of pounds a year. As my hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West (Julie Hilling) has just said, all the evidence shows that early intervention with community services is cost-effective, it keeps people out of hospital, it is what people with dementia and their families want, and, in particular, it is what the people who have the main responsibility for caring for those sufferers want.

However, the tightening of the eligibility criteria and the cutting of local services are having the opposite effect: they are increasing the costs for the NHS. I do not know whether the Minister has any figures with him. If he does not, perhaps he could write to me, as I would be interested to know whether he has made an assessment of the impact on the NHS in the south-west of the tightening of eligibility criteria by local authorities in the area for people with dementia.

By 2021, more than a million people will be living with dementia in the UK, and this year dementia is set to cost us £23 billion. In the next 10 years, the number of people in Devon with dementia is set to increase by a third. It has been said before, but I will say it again: we face a dementia time bomb. Addressing it will require leadership and more public investment in the short term, but a successful dementia strategy will be much cheaper and equitable in the long run, and it will also reduce the strain on and suffering of patients and their families. Surely it cannot be too much to expect that someone with dementia can receive a decent level of care wherever they live in the country and that their families should no longer to be subjected to the ruinous costs of long-term care simply because they happened to have a relative who suffered from this illness.

10.46 pm

The Minister of State, Department of Health (Paul Burstow): I congratulate the right hon. Member for Exeter (Mr Bradshaw) on securing this debate. He is absolutely right to highlight the importance of the issue of dementia. It is, without doubt, one of the biggest health and personal issues affecting our society today, and it will touch the lives of many families in this country. He rightly rehearses the statistics, and dementia is a priority for this Government. We know that in England there are 670,000 people living with dementia, that the figure is set to double over the next 30 years and that in England the cost of dementia to society as a whole is about £19 billion. However, the true costs of dementia are incalculable. I am talking about the cost in terms of the impact on people’s lives, the lost opportunities and the consequences of taking on a caring responsibility within the family, and the costs and consequences for the individual. As has been said in this debate, we know that cancer has been replaced by dementia as the disease that people in their 50s now fear the most, and the right hon. Gentleman has highlighted a number of reasons for that.

That is why, on 26 March, the Prime Minister, on behalf of this coalition Government, set out this Government’s dementia challenge: to go further and faster in implementing the previous Government’s dementia strategy; to focus, in particular, on the issue of diagnosis rates; to raise awareness and ensure that we prepare our society to be adapted and adaptable to the needs of

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people with dementia; and to double the research funding available in the area of neurosciences and dementia by 2015.

The dementia challenge builds on the previous Government’s work on the national dementia strategy. We kept and built on that strategy, rather than losing any of the momentum that it put in place. I pay tribute to the Alzheimer’s Society for the work it does, and we are working closely with it. We have brought together three champion groups that are taking forward the work on raising the need to improve diagnosis and the treatment and care of people so diagnosed. We are also focusing on issues associated with how we raise awareness, both within the social care and health care work forces and in wider public services. Finally, we are working with the research community to improve capacity significantly and make sure that we have more good quality bids for funding for dementia research in this country.

On the recognition of dementia, we need to ensure that the challenge is not just for the national health service or social services departments, but for our whole society. Work is being led by the Alzheimer’s Society and one of its key champions and ambassadors, Angela Rippon, on how we create dementia-friendly cities, towns and villages. The county of Devon is taking a lead working with schools so that young people better understand dementia and get involved in services supporting people with dementia in the community.

The Government have laid the foundations for dementia research, investing heavily in biomedical research centres and seeding the necessary interest among the research community through themed calls. Something in the region of £17 million of new money is now going into research.

The right hon. Gentleman is right on diagnosis: there is still inexplicable and unacceptable variation within his own region, let alone across the whole of England. In 2011, 30,000 people had been diagnosed and were living with dementia in the south-west, which is among the lowest rates in England. However, we know from the figures that the movement is in the right direction. It is not as fast as he would like, nor as fast as I want it to be in future, but in 2010, the diagnosis rate was 35.4%; by 2011, it had risen to 37.3%.

The Government are ensuring through our dementia challenge that general practitioners and other health professionals are referring more people for assessment. We are making people aware of the availability of memory services and targeting hospitals to ensure that they receive extra resources to undertake dementia risk assessments of people over the age of 75. There will be additional resources to support that activity. We are confident that it will lead to a significant increase in the numbers of people being both diagnosed and referred for diagnosis.

The right hon. Gentleman referred to the Royal College of Psychiatrists accreditation programme. I endorse what he said. It is important that more memory services seek that accreditation, and many in his region are doing just that.

I can tell the right hon. Gentleman that there has been a further acceleration in progress on diagnosis. Devon commissioners tell me that, in the past year, Exeter has been among the strongest performers in Devon in improving its rate of diagnosis. Indeed, there

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was an 11.6% increase in the number of people receiving a diagnosis in the county. The local NHS is building into its commissioning plans for the coming year an improving diagnosis trajectory. I hope that he and other hon. Members continue to hold local commissioners to account for their commissioning decisions on dementia.

The right hon. Gentleman referred to Northern Ireland and the reasons for its success. One reason Northern Ireland has been successful is that it has invested heavily in its community and voluntary sector services, which has played a part in raising community awareness. More people have in turn asked whether they need to be referred to a memory service. That is one reason why the Government have sponsored an advertising campaign. We want to raise awareness and get families to talk about dementia, and not to put it off or believe that it is just a consequence of ageing.

Alison Seabeck: What the Minister says about Northern Ireland and the figures for Devon is interesting. Does he believe there is a connection between dementia diagnosis and support and the relative stability of a population, such as that of Belfast? Devon has a more transient population, and people move there to see out their old age, perhaps away from their families. How important is proximity to family and close friends in terms of diagnosis and support?

Paul Burstow: That is part of the Government’s approach to raising awareness. We recognise that getting families to have conversations when they see the first signs of memory loss, or other behaviours that might indicate dementia, is an essential part of getting people to have a conversation with their GP about referral to a memory service. Whether that is to do with more stable communities is an interesting question to consider further. We are working with the research community because we want to encourage more applications for social research as well as research into the underlying causes of the disease.

The right hon. Member for Exeter asked about waiting times. Although there have not historically been routine central collections of waiting times, we will have to consider the matter closely. The Government are keen to drive improvements, and it is no good somebody getting a referral if they and their family are then left hanging for too long. He made an important challenge on that matter.

The right hon. Gentleman rightly talked about support for families. In the operating framework for the NHS, which we published last December and which covers this year, we were absolutely explicit that NHS organisations must work with local authorities and carers’ organisations to get their sign-off for their plans for carers. We stated that they must be explicit about the number of carers’ breaks they will provide and the budget that they allocate for carers in their area. We need to ensure that carers get vital breaks, rather than having to have a breakdown before the NHS picks up the pieces.

From next year, we will also expect NHS organisations to demonstrate that they are supporting carers of people with dementia in line with the guidance that the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence issues. Early diagnosis is important because families and the individual themselves need to be able to plan, but also because NICE’s guidance on medication states that people need access to drugs at an early stage. I will write to the right hon. Gentleman about the variations that exist.

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Julie Hilling: What are the Minister’s views on the funding of dementia groups and carers’ groups? I visited my local group a fortnight ago, and it is struggling for money because of cuts in its local authority grants and health grants. Will there be money behind the new strategy for carers, and more money to support dementia groups in the community?

Paul Burstow: I say two things in response to that question. First, the picture is actually quite varied, and I will come on to the investment that is being made in the support network of voluntary and community organisations in Devon. Secondly, the Government have provided £400 million, through the NHS, to support carers through carers’ breaks and other arrangements. We have specifically said that local plans will have to be signed off by carers’ organisations to ensure that the voice of carers is heard when decisions are made.

The right hon. Gentleman asked me about the costs facing families. I understand that concern, which the House has been debating for at least the past 15 years, and it is important that we reach conclusions. We will shortly publish a White Paper and a progress report on our deliberations on funding reform. Dilnot produced a clear set of recommendations, which the Government welcomed when they were published last year.

It is also important to stress that funding reform, important though it is, is only one of a number of issues to consider in improving social care in England. Others include variability of quality, a lack of focus on prevention and early intervention, services that do not join up well for families and do not always integrate well with the NHS, and a lack of personalisation. We expect to address all those issues in the White Paper that we will publish shortly.

When it comes to legislation, we will publish a draft Bill before the summer recess, which will set out the details of a comprehensive reform of social care. We will address the fact that for 60 years, social care legislation in this country has evolved in a piecemeal fashion and as a consequence, in my view, constitutes something of a dog’s breakfast. It is hard for people to navigate their way around the system and identify when they are entitled to support from their local authority and when they are not.

Innovation is important in driving improvements in quality for people with dementia. That is one reason why, as part of the dementia challenge, we identified an innovation prize of £1 million for NHS organisations developing ideas for the transformation of dementia care services. In the south-west and south of England, the NHS has specifically identified and made available a further £10 million for such innovations.

I said that I wanted to mention briefly some of the other actions in the south-west. The Royal Devon and Exeter NHS Foundation Trust has piloted patient passports in a very good piloting exercise. It has alighted on a scheme proposed by the Alzheimer’s Society called “This is me” passports, which are very useful for people with out-patient appointments and those who are being discharged from hospital. The trust is also running an “An hour to remember” training programme to raise the awareness of staff about both the people who have dementia and the people who are with them—that is, their family members and carers—and that is ever so critical. Every fortnight, there is a day’s training in

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dementia care for clinical and ancillary staff. The trust has also recently strengthened its mental health liaison services and is reaching out into its communities to pilot a virtual ward scheme, which is a very important way of avoiding unnecessary admissions into hospital. Beyond the hospital, there are networks of support and there are 37 memory cafés around the county—I believe that there is one in Exeter itself—and more than 200 volunteers have been trained in dementia awareness to help support those areas.

The right hon. Gentleman also mentioned the role of GPs. I am not certain that we have the same figures, but my understanding is that 67 of the 107 GP practices across Devon have already undergone GP-led dementia training, which has already led to a significant increase in the number of referrals going through.

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There is much to be done and much that the Government are doing already. There are significant signs of progress up and down the country. The dementia challenge set out by the Prime Minister in March is real and it is about ensuring that we mobilise not just the national health service and our local authorities but our whole community to engage with one of the biggest challenges faced by our society. I would certainly say that the evidence points towards a lot of hard work being done by NHS and social care professionals across Devon and the south-west that is beginning to lead to a significant increase in the diagnosis rates. As a consequence, many more people are getting the treatment and care that they need and that their loved ones deserve. I thank the right hon. Gentleman for securing this debate.

Question put and agreed to.

11.1 pm

House adjourned.