Formal Minutes
Wednesday 24 February 2016
Members present:
David T.C. Davies, in the Chair
|
Byron Davies Chris Davies Dr James Davies Gerald Jones |
Stephen Kinnock Liz Saville Roberts Mr Mark Williams |
Draft Report (Pre-legislative scrutiny of the draft Wales Bill), proposed by the Chair, brought up and read.
Ordered, That the draft Report be read a second time, paragraph by paragraph.
Paragraphs 1 to 50 read and agreed to.
Paragraph 51 read, as follows:
“There is a growing body of Welsh law that differs from that which applies in England. This introduces complexity, but we understand the draft Bill could work without a Welsh legal jurisdiction. Any decision to modify the justice system, which has worked well for centuries, would need to be based on very sound foundations. Even the introduction or formal recognition of a more limited ‘distinct’ jurisdiction—seen by a number of witnesses as a solution to some complexity in the draft Bill—is something which would need careful scrutiny. We have not consulted about this idea, though given the range of our opinions (and lack of wider political consensus) it is unlikely to be something on which we would have reached agreement. As the Silk Commission recommended, the UK and Welsh governments will need to continue to review the issue of a separate or distinct Welsh jurisdiction.”
Motion made, to leave out paragraph 51 and insert the following new paragraphs:
“We recognise that there is a growing body of Welsh law differing from that which applies in England, and that the requirement of the draft Bill to maintain the unified legal jurisdiction of England and Wales has raised a number of complex supplementary issues.
Witnesses discussed the advantages of both separate and distinct jurisdictions. The majority of witnesses recommended the creation of a distinct legal jurisdiction, and it is recognised that this would provide a solution to issues associated with the reservation of civil and criminal law and necessity clauses. This proposal has been unanimously supported by the National Assembly of Wales.
The term ‘distinct legal jurisdiction’ need not entail establishing a separate legal jurisdiction with a separate system of courts and separate legal professions.” —(Liz Saville Roberts)
Question put, That paragraph 51 be disagreed to and the new paragraphs be read a second time.
The Committee divided:
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Ayes, 4 Gerald Jones Stephen Kinnock Liz Saville Roberts Mr Mark Williams |
Noes, 3 Byron Davies Chris Davies Dr James Davies |
Question accordingly agreed to.
Paragraph 51 disagreed to and new paragraphs inserted (now paragraphs 51, 52 and 53).
Paragraph—(Liz Saville Roberts)—brought up and read as follows:
“We recommend that the UK and Welsh governments should work together to agree a mutually-acceptable definition of distinct legal jurisdiction, in accordance with Silk Commission recommendations, and adapt the final Bill accordingly.”
Question proposed, That the paragraph be read a second time.
The Committee divided:
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Ayes, 3 Gerald Jones Liz Saville Roberts Mr Mark Williams |
Noes, 3 Byron Davies Chris Davies Dr James Davies |
Whereupon the Chair declared himself with the Noes.
Question accordingly negatived.
Paragraphs 52 to 107 (now paragraphs 54 to 109) read and agreed to.
Resolved, That the Report be the First Report of the Committee to the House.
Ordered, That the Chair make the Report to the House.
Ordered, That embargoed copies of the Report be made available, in accordance with the provisions of Standing Order No. 134.
[Adjourned till Monday 29 February at 12.00 pm at the National Assembly for Wales
© Parliamentary copyright 2015
Prepared 26 February 2016