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House of Lords Journal 234 (Session 2000-01)

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Tuesday 23 January 2001

The House met at half-past two o’clock.

The following Lords Spiritual and Temporal were present:

Irvine of Lairg, L.
(Lord Chancellor)

Aberdare, L.
Ackner, L.
Acton, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alderdice, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Alli, L.
Alton of Liverpool, L.
Amos, B.
Ampthill, L.
Andrews, B.
Anelay of St Johns, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Ashcroft, L.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Ashton of Upholland, B.
Astor of Hever, L.
Attlee, E.
Avebury, L.
Bach, L.
Baker of Dorking, L.
Baldwin of Bewdley, E.
Barker, B.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Bellwin, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Biffen, L.
 Billingham, B.
Blackburn, Bp.
Blackstone, B.
Blackwell, L.
Blatch, B.
Blease, L.
Boardman, L.
Boothroyd, B.
Borrie, L.
Boston of Faversham, L.
Bowness, L.
Brabazon of Tara, L.
Bradford, Bp.
Bradshaw, L.
Bragg, L.
Bramall, L.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Brightman, L.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Brookeborough, V.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Bruce of Donington, L.
Burlison, L.
Burnham, L.
Burns, L.
 Buscombe, B.
Butterworth, L.
Byford, B.
Caithness, E.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Campbell of Croy, L.
Carlile of Berriew, L.
Carlisle of Bucklow, L.
Carnarvon, E.
Carr of Hadley, L.
Carter, L.
Chadlington, L.
Chalfont, L.
Chandos, V.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Cockfield, L.
Cocks of Hartcliffe, L.
Coe, L.
Cohen of Pimlico, B.
Colwyn, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L.
Courtown, E.
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Cranborne, V.
Crathorne, L.
Crawley, B.
Cuckney, L.
Cumberlege, B.
Dahrendorf, L.

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Darcy de Knayth, B.
David, B.
Davies of Coity, L.
Davies of Oldham, L.
Denham, L.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dixon, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Donoughue, L.
Dormand of Easington, L.
Dubs, L.
Eatwell, L.
Eccles of Moulton, B.
Elles, B.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Erroll, E.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Evans of Watford, L.
Ezra, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L.
Falkland, V.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Feldman, L.
Ferrers, E.
Filkin, L.
Fitt, L.
Flather, B.
Flowers, L.
Fookes, B.
Forsyth of Drumlean, L.
Fraser of Carmyllie, L.
Freeman, L.
Freyberg, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Garel-Jones, L.
Geddes, L.
Geraint, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gilbert, L.
Gilmour of Craigmillar, L.
Gladwin of Clee, L.
Glenarthur, L.
Glentoran, L.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Goschen, V.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Grabiner, L.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greengross, B.
Greenway, L.
Gregson, L.
Grenfell, L.
Griffiths, L.
Griffiths of Fforestfach, L.
Hamwee, B.
Hanham, B.
Hanningfield, L.
Hardy of Wath, L.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
 Haskel, L.
Haslam, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Henley, L.
Higgins, L.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hogg, B.
Holderness, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Hope of Craighead, L.
Howe, E.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Chesterton, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Hurd of Westwell, L.
Hutchinson of Lullington, L.
Hutton, L.
Hylton, L.
Inge, L.
Islwyn, L.
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
Jeger, B.
Jellicoe, E.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Jenkins of Hillhead, L.
Jenkins of Putney, L.
Jopling, L.
Kimball, L.
King of Wartnaby, L.
King of West Bromwich, L.
Kingsland, L.
Kirkhill, L.
Laird, L.
Lamont of Lerwick, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Lawson of Blaby, L.
Layard, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Lindsay, E.
Lipsey, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, E.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
Longford, E.
Lucas, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
Mackay of Ardbrecknish, L.
Mackay of Clashfern, L.
Mackay of Drumadoon, L.
MacKenzie of Culkein, L.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
MacLaurin of Knebworth, L.
McNally, L.
Maddock, B.
Mallalieu, B.
 Mancroft, L.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Marlesford, L.
Marsh, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Merlyn-Rees, L.
Mishcon, L.
Mitchell, L.
Molloy, L.
Molyneaux of Killead, L.
Monson, L.
Montagu of Beaulieu, L.
Montrose, D.
Moore of Wolvercote, L.
Morris of Castle Morris, L.
Morris of Manchester, L.
Mowbray and Stourton, L.
Moynihan, L.
Murton of Lindisfarne, L.
Newton of Braintree, L.
Nicol, B.
Noakes, B.
Northbourne, L.
Northesk, E.
Northover, B.
Norton of Louth, L.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
O’Cathain, B.
Orme, L.
Oxford, Bp.
Oxfuird, V.
Palmer, L.
Parekh, L.
Park of Monmouth, B.
Parkinson, L.
Patel, L.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Patten, L.
Paul, L.
Pearson of Rannoch, L.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Peston, L.
Peyton of Yeovil, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Pilkington of Oxenford, L.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Plumb, L.
Prior, L.
Puttnam, L.
Quirk, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Rawlings, B.
Rawlinson of Ewell, L.
Razzall, L.
Rea, L.
Reay, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rees, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Renfrew of Kaimsthorn, L.
Rennard, L.
Renton, L.
Renton of Mount Harry, L.
Richard, L.
Rix, L.
Roberts of Conwy, L.

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Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Rogers of Riverside, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Roper, L.
Russell, E.
Sainsbury of Turville, L.
St. John of Bletso, L.
St. John of Fawsley, L.
Sandberg, L.
Sawyer, L.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Seccombe, B.
Selborne, E.
Selsdon, L.
Serota, B.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Shepherd, L.
Shore of Stepney, L.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Simon of Glaisdale, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Skidelsky, L.
Smith of Leigh, L.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Southwark, Bp.
Stallard, L.
 Stern, B.
Stewartby, L.
Stodart of Leaston, L.
Stoddart of Swindon, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strange, B.
Strathclyde, L.
Swinfen, L.
Symons of Vernham Dean, B.
Tanlaw, L.
Taverne, L.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Taylor of Gryfe, L.
Taylor of Warwick, L.
Tebbit, L.
Tenby, V.
Thomas of Gresford, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B.
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Thornton, B.
Tomlinson, L.
Tope, L.
Tordoff, L.
Trumpington, B.
Tugendhat, L.
Turnberg, L.
Uddin, B.
 Vivian, L.
Waddington, L.
Wakefield, Bp.
Wakeham, L.
Walker of Doncaster, L.
Walker of Worcester, L.
Wallace of Saltaire, L.
Walmsley, B.
Walpole, L.
Walton of Detchant, L.
Warner, L.
Warnock, B.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Watson of Richmond, L.
Waverley, V.
Weatherill, L.
Whitaker, B.
Wigoder, L.
Wilberforce, L.
Wilcox, B.
Williams of Crosby, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Willoughby de Broke, L.
Wilson of Tillyorn, L.
Winston, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Wright of Richmond, L.
Young, B.

PRAYERS were read by the Lord Bishop of Blackburn.

Judicial Business

1.Kuwait Airways Corporation (Respondents) v. Iraqi Airways Company (Petitioners) and others—The petition of Iraqi Airways Company praying for leave to appeal was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.
2.Regina v. Smith (Respondent) (2001)—The petition of Her Majestys Commissioners of Customs and Excise praying for leave to appeal in accordance with the Criminal Appeal Act 1968 was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee (lodged 20th December).
3.Regina v. Criminal Cases Review Commission (Respondents) and Commissioners of Inland Revenue (Interested Party) ex parte Hunt (Petitioner)—The petition of Michael John Hunt, praying for an extension of time within which the petition may be lodged and for leave to appeal in accordance with the Criminal Appeal Act 1968, was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.
4.Odyssey RE (London) Limited and others (Respondents) v. OIC Run-off Limited (formerly The Orion Insurance Company plc) (Appellants)—The petition of the appellants praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 9th March next (the agents for the respondents consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed.
5.Commissioners of Customs and Excise (Appellants) v. Plantiflor Limited (Respondents)—The petition of the appellants praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 7th February next (the agents for the respondents consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed.
6.Krasner (the trustee in bankruptcy of John William Alexander Dennison) (Respondent) v. Dennison (AP) (Appellant) and others—The petition of the appellant praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 19th February next (the agents for the respondent consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed.
7.Director General of Fair Trading (Respondent) v. First National Bank plc (Appellants)—The petition of the appellants praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 6th March next (the agents for the respondent consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed.

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Papers

8.Negative Instruments—The following instruments were laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.Stakeholder Pension Schemes (Amendment) Regulations 2001, laid under the Welfare Reform and Pensions Act 1999;
 (104)
2.Alterations in the provisions of the Highway Code proposed to be made by the Secretary of State for the Environment, Transport and the Regions, laid under the Road Traffic Act 1988.
 (—)
9.Paper not subject to parliamentary proceedings—The following paper was laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:

Report for 1998–1999 on Treasure, laid under the Treasure Act 1996.

Select Committee Report

10.Statutory Instruments—The 4th Report from the Joint Committee was made on certain statutory instruments, including the following affirmative instruments:
 Draft Terrorism Act 2000 (Code of Practice for Authorised Officers) Order 2001;
 Draft Terrorism Act 2000 (Code of Practice for Examining Officers) Order 2001;
 Draft Terrorism Act 2000 (Code of Practice on the Exercise of Police Powers) (Northern Ireland) Order 2001;
 Draft Terrorism Act 2000 (Code of Practice on Video Recording of Interviews) (Northern Ireland) Order 2001;
 Draft Companies (EU Political Expenditure) Exemption Order 2001;
 Draft Local Elections (Northern Ireland) (Amendment) Order 2001;
 Draft Representation of the People (England and Wales) Regulations 2001;
 Draft Representation of the People (Northern Ireland) Regulations 2001;
 Draft Terrorism (Interviews) (Scotland) Order 2001;
 Draft Representation of the People (Scotland) Regulations 2001;

it was ordered that the Report be printed. (HL Paper 23)

Public Business

11.Standing Orders (Public Business)—It was moved by the Baroness Jay of Paddington that the Standing Orders relating to public business be amended as follows:

After Standing Order 10 (hereditary peers: by-elections)

Insert the following new Standing Order:

10A.Register of hereditary peersAny hereditary peer (not previously in receipt of a writ of summons) who wishes to be included in the register maintained by the Clerk of the Parliaments pursuant to Standing Order 10(5) shall petition the House and any such petition shall be referred to the Lord Chancellor to consider and report upon whether such peer has established his right to be included in the register.

Standing Order 40 (arrangement of the Order Paper)

After paragraph (6), insert the following new paragraph:

 (“( ) Any motion relating to a report from the Joint Committee on Human Rights on a remedial order or draft remedial order laid under Schedule 2 to the Human Rights Act 1998 shall be entered before a motion to approve that order or draft order.”)

Standing Order 64 (sessional committees)

After (“House of Lords’ Offices Committee”) insert (“Human Rights Committee”)

Standing Order 72 (affirmative instruments)

In paragraph (1)(a), after (“Deregulation and Contracting Out Act 1994”) insert (“or a draft remedial order or remedial order laid under Schedule 2 to the Human Rights Act 1998”)

In paragraph (1)(b), after (“Delegated Powers and Deregulation Committee”) insert:

 (“( ) in the case of a draft remedial order or remedial order laid under Schedule 2 to the Human Rights Act 1998, there has been laid before the House the report thereon of the Joint Committee on Human Rights:
 Provided that the report is laid
(i)in the case of a draft remedial order, within 60 days of the laying of the draft order or

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(ii)in the case of an order not approved in draft, within 119 days of the making of the original order,

such periods to be calculated in the manner prescribed by Schedule 2 to the Act;”)

Standing Order 73 (Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments)

In paragraph (1), after (“Deregulation and Contracting Out Act 1994”) insert (“and any remedial order or draft remedial order under Schedule 2 to the Human Rights Act 1998”)

In paragraph (2), line 4, after (“but”) insert (“not including any statutory instrument made by a member of the Scottish Executive or by the National Assembly for Wales unless it is required to be laid before Parliament or either House of Parliament and”)

the motion was agreed to; it was ordered that the amendments be printed. (HL Paper 22)

12.Procedure of the House—It was moved by the Chairman of Committees that the First Report from the Select Committee (HL Paper 16) be agreed to; then it was moved by the Lord Rodgers of Quarry Bank, as an amendment thereto, at end to insert “except for item 1”; after debate, the amendment was agreed to (see division list); then the original motion as amended was agreed to.
13.Regulatory Reform Bill [HL]—The House resolved itself into a Committee upon the bill; amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; the House was resumed.
14.Legal Advice and Assistance (Scope) (Amendment) Regulations 2001—It was moved by the Lord Bach that the draft Regulations laid before the House on 11th December be approved; the motion was agreed to.
15.Access to Justice Act 1999 (Bar Practising Certificates) Order 2001—It was moved by the Lord Bach that the draft Order laid before the House on 15th January be approved; after debate, the motion was agreed to.

The House was adjourned during pleasure.
The House was resumed.

16.Regulatory Reform Bill [HL]—The House again resolved itself into a Committee upon the bill; amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; the House was resumed after clause 3 stood part.

The House was adjourned at twelve minutes before eleven o’clock
till tomorrow, half-past two o’clock.

DIVISION

PROCEDURE OF THE HOUSE

It was moved by the Lord Rodgers of Quarry Bank, as an amendment to the motion, That the First Report from the Select Committee be agreed to, at end to insert “except for item 1”; which being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the House divided:

Contents.............130

Not-Contents.............128

CONTENTS

Ackner, L.
Addington, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Alton of Liverpool, L.
Ampthill, L.
Astor of Hever, L.
Avebury, L.
Baker of Dorking, L.
Barker, B.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Biffen, L.
Boardman, L.
Bowness, L.
Brabazon of Tara, L.
Bradshaw, L.
Bramall, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Brightman, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Bruce of Donington, L.
 Burnham, L.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Carlisle of Bucklow, L.
Carnarvon, E.
Chadlington, L.
Chalfont, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Cockfield, L.
Cocks of Hartcliffe, L.
Coe, L.
Courtown, E.
Craigavon, V.
Cranborne, V.
Cuckney, L.
Dahrendorf, L.
Darcy de Knayth, B.
Denham, L. [Teller]
Dholakia, L.
Elles, B.
Elton, L.
Ezra, L.
 Falkland, V.
Ferrers, E.
Flowers, L.
Fookes, B.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Geddes, L.
Goschen, V.
Greenway, L.
Hamwee, B.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Haslam, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Hogg, B.
Holderness, L.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Hutchinson of Lullington, L.
Hylton, L.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Jenkins of Hillhead, L.

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Jopling, L.
Kimball, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, E.
Lucas, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
Mackay of Clashfern, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
Maddock, B.
Mancroft, L.
Marlesford, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Molyneaux of Killead, L.
Monson, L.
Montrose, D.
Moore of Wolvercote, L.
Noakes, B.
Northbourne, L.
Northover, B.
 Norton of Louth, L.
O’Cathain, B.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
Oxfuird, V.
Park of Monmouth, B.
Patten, L.
Pearson of Rannoch, L.
Peyton of Yeovil, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Plumb, L.
Prior, L.
Reay, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rees, L.
Renfrew of Kaimsthorn, L.
Renton, L.
Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Roper, L.
Russell, E.
Sandberg, L.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
 Shaw of Northstead, L.
Simon of Glaisdale, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Strange, B.
Swinfen, L.
Taverne, L.
Tebbit, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B. [Teller]
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Tope, L.
Tordoff, L.
Trumpington, B.
Vivian, L.
Waddington, L.
Walmsley, B.
Walton of Detchant, L.
Watson of Richmond, L.
Weatherill, L.
Wilberforce, L.
Williams of Crosby, B.
Winston, L.
Young, B.

NOT-CONTENTS

Acton, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alli, L.
Amos, B.
Andrews, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Blackstone, B.
Blease, L.
Bragg, L.
Brett, L.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Burlison, L.
Burns, L.
Carter, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Colwyn, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L.
Crawley, B.
David, B.
Davies of Coity, L.
Davies of Oldham, L.
Dixon, L.
Dormand of Easington, L.
Dubs, L. [Teller]
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Evans of Watford, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Filkin, L.
Flather, B.
Fraser of Carmyllie, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gilbert, L.
Gladwin of Clee, L.
 Goldsmith, L.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Grabiner, L.
Graham of Edmonton, L. [Teller]
Gray of Contin, L.
Greengross, B.
Hanham, B.
Hardy of Wath, L.
Haskel, L.
Henley, L.
Hogg of Cumbernauld, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Irvine of Lairg, L.
(Lord Chancellor)
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
(Lord Privy Seal)
Jeger, B.
King of West Bromwich, L.
Lipsey, L.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
Longford, E.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
MacKenzie of Culkein, L.
Mallalieu, B.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Marsh, L.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Merlyn-Rees, L.
Mishcon, L.
Mitchell, L.
Molloy, L.
Morris of Castle Morris, L.
Morris of Manchester, L.
Mowbray and Stourton, L.
 Nicol, B.
Orme, L.
Parekh, L.
Paul, L.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Peston, L.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Puttnam, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Rea, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Richard, L.
Rix, L.
Rogers of Riverside, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Sainsbury of Turville, L.
Sawyer, L.
Serota, B.
Shepherd, L.
Shore of Stepney, L.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Smith of Leigh, L.
Stallard, L.
Stoddart of Swindon, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strathclyde, L.
Symons of Vernham Dean, B.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Taylor of Gryfe, L.
Tenby, V.
Thornton, B.
Tomlinson, L.
Turnberg, L.
Uddin, B.
Wakefield, Bp.
Walker of Doncaster, L.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Waverley, V.
Whitaker, B.
Wilcox, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.

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APPENDIX

PROCEEDINGS OF THE GRAND COMMITTEE (IN THE MOSES ROOM)

The Committee met at half-past three o’clock.

Special Educational Needs and Disability Bill [HL]—The bill was considered in a Grand Committee; amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; an amendment was agreed to; the Committee was adjourned after clause 1 stood apart.

The Committee was adjourned at half-past seven o’clock until Monday 29th January athalf-past three o’clock.