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Lord Waddington: My Lords, I object to the state funding of political parties. I object as a matter of principle. I object to being required to support a party whose views may be anathema to me and may be attacking the values I hold most dear. I also object in practice because I believe that a party which is firmly based on the contributions of its members is far more likely to reflect the wishes of the electorate, or a part of it, than a party which is the recipient of funds which it has in no way earned.

If I object in principle to the public funding of political parties in this country, it is not surprising if I also object to the public funding of parties in Europe. I am blessed if I see why I should be required to support financially a European party which may be dedicated to destroying Britain as a nation state.

I believe that the particular proposal—the amendment to Article 191—is a threat to democracy. It is said that the amendment to Article 191, which states:


is necessary in order to stop abuse. That may be true, but no one can deny that the power taken in Article 191 is immensely wide. It is so wide that it would never be acceptable in domestic legislation.

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The article is certainly wide enough to allow regulations which denied funding to, or even banned, parties which opposed the ever-closer union referred to in the treaty. It is wide enough to ban parties or deny funding to parties taking the wholly acceptable view that closer union than the one we have at the moment would involve a wholly unacceptable erosion of the sovereignty of nation states. And how can it be said that the risk does not exist when one reads Article 191 as a whole? The article, including the amendment to allow the regulation of political parties, begins by stating:


    "Political parties at European level are important as a factor for integration within the Union. They contribute towards forming a European awareness and to expressing the political will of the citizens of the Union".

What about democratic parties which do not want further political integration? That is the question which must be asked. They do not seem to be covered by Article 191 either before or after amendment.

I take no comfort whatever in Declaration 11, to which I would draw the attention of the House. This was referred to in Committee by the noble Lord, Lord McIntosh of Haringey. Perhaps I may remind noble Lords of the terms of that declaration. It states that:


    "The conference recalls that the provisions of Article 191 do not imply any transfer of powers to the European Community and do not affect the application of the relevant national constitutional rules".

I do not see what that has to do with the points that I have raised or how it in any way dispenses with my worries. I know of no national constitutional rules which have any bearing whatever on the funding of parties in Europe. Which national constitutional rules have a bearing on this subject? What on earth has Declaration 11 to do with the matter we are debating today? It is absolutely plain that, if properly used, the power which is sought in Article 191 will engender no mischief. However, no one can deny that it is an immensely wide power which could be misused. That is why I am frightened about it.

I am against the funding of political parties. I am against the funding of European political parties. As a taxpayer in this country I object very strongly to being required to cough up to support European parties which are out to do something which is anathema to me. I therefore object strongly to this proposal and that is that.

Lord Pearson of Rannoch: My Lords, in supporting the amendment I agree with my noble friend Lord Waddington that the aim of this article is absolutely clear:


    "Political parties at European level are important as a factor for integration within the Union".

I know that my noble friend has quoted that statement, but I have repeated it because the noble Baroness really must start by getting around that one. I agree that the statement was included in the treaty before Nice, but there it is.

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Now, by the usual process of Eurocreep, we have the new procedure added by Nice, which I should point out to your Lordships is under Article 251, covering the co-decision procedure of the Communities. That starts off with qualified majority voting in the Council, which then has to be ratified by the Parliament. Thus the regulations we are presently talking about could in effect be decided beyond our control.

I should like to make a final comment on Declaration 11, the first sentence of which my noble friend Lord Waddington quoted to the House. There follows a truly amazing statement, even by the standards of our friends in Brussels:


    "The funding for political parties at European level provided out of the budget of the European Communities may not be used to fund, either directly or indirectly, political parties at national level".

If ever I have heard of a pious hope, it is that one. How does one differentiate between the travel expenses of a political party? Who will audit this? Clearly it is impossible to separate, shall we say, the Labour Party or, indeed, the Conservative Party in this country which is funded for its European interests not to use those moneys or not even to have to raise money for something else that takes place in this country?

As usual, the object of the exercise is perfectly clear. Our Eurocratic friends in Brussels want to control the political parties. I would remind noble Lords that that was how the Soviet Union was controlled. There was no bar on political parties: you just could not stand at elections or receive funds. If you spoke your mind, you went to the gulag. I expect that eventually that will be on its way here, but I think that we should test it now.

6.45 p.m.

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean: My Lords, I am sure that those noble Lords who had the pleasure of sitting through the Committee stage of the Bill will agree that this was a question extensively debated at that stage. Furthermore, as one might expect on an issue of this nature, it was extensively debated in another place.

In Committee my noble friend Lord McIntosh of Haringey explained that negotiations are already well advanced under the provisions of the present EC treaty on a regulation which will provide for funding and to ensure—this point lies at the root of the problem identified by the noble Lord, Lord Howell—proper transparency and accountability. I could not agree more with the sentiments expressed by the noble Lord about ensuring that that is the case. That regulation will have to be agreed unanimously and we hope that it will be agreed to soon.

As the noble Lord said, it is important that we put a stop to the abuses which have been recognised and which have, I believe, received a good deal of publicity. That is the reason for looking at the regulations under the current legislation before we move on to looking at any further regulations under the legislation before the House.

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I can assure noble Lords that the details of funds received by the European political parties under these arrangements will be made available to the House. That forms an important part of the scrutiny. Indeed, I would suggest that they already have been. The present draft regulation, which proposes total annual funding of £4.6 million for European political parties, has been made available to, discussed in, and cleared by, the European Union Committee of this House. An opportunity has been provided for those noble Lords serving on that committee to scrutinise the regulation.

This regulation requires annual reports on the funds received by European political parties under it. Those reports will continue to be made available to the House. I hope that that will be a welcome assurance.

The regulation now being negotiated will expire two years after its entry into force. Another regulation will then be agreed, following a report from the Commission. We would expect that to be agreed under the new provisions; that is, the provisions of the Nice treaty, provided that the treaty has entered into force by that stage.

Both the future regulation and the Commission's report will be deposited for parliamentary scrutiny in the usual way. This House and another place have effective means of scrutinising European Community documents. Of course Her Majesty's Government will continue to support that scrutiny.

Thus Members of this House have had and will continue to have all the relevant information on this issue. Furthermore, I hope and believe that your Lordships have had and will continue to have ample opportunity to debate it. However, the fact is that Nice provides a new legal base for a measure to regulate European political parties, in particular their funding arrangements.

I turn to the points made by the noble Lord, Lord Waddington. The provisions provide for an amendment to Article 191 and it is the amendment to that article which we are discussing here. It creates a legal base for a statute to regulate European political parties. Of course the parties are not new; nor is their recognition in the treaty; nor is the funding new. I think that the noble Lord objects not so much to what is now in the treaty by means of regulation, but to the fact that some of those provisions already exist. Of course he is perfectly entitled to his opinion and many may agree with the cogent points he has made as regards the ways in which political parties are funded. However, what we are discussing here is the regulation of that funding. Surely the noble Lord would agree with his noble friend that the regulation of that funding is enormously important, in particular in light of what has been said by the Court of Auditors.


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