| Previous Section | Back to Table of Contents | Lords Hansard Home Page |
Baroness Sharp of Guildford moved Amendment No. 35:
- Page 11, line 40, at end insert "or in accordance with subsection (1A) below.
The noble Baroness said: My Lords, in moving this amendment, I shall speak also to Amendment No. 36.
This amendment would help to eliminate some of the unnecessary new regulations that may be issued. The amendment is relatively self-explanatory. It relates to governing bodies and whether we need to have a new set of regulations in relation to them.
As we discussed at length in Committee, governing bodies have only recently been reconstituted under the regulations that were agreed as recently as 1999. For some governing bodies, this caused considerable upheaval. For others, it caused a degree of work that diverted their energies from the more important issue of governing their schools. I suspect that a majority of governors will see no reason for further reconstitution and, indeed, could become alienated were this change
However, some governing bodies may find this further so-called flexible model that the Minister is introducing attractive. In Committee, the Minister talked a great deal about the Way Forward Group. Some members of the group were quite keen on this idea and would like to go forward and reconstitute.
The great advantage of the amendment is that it provides an option. It provides schools with the option, if they so wish, to retain the instruments of government that were in place in September 2002 so that they can continue for the next 10 years under those instruments of government. As I understand it, the Minister intends in any case to phase in the new proposals somewhat slowly to give time for schools to change over. The amendment seeks to extend that period by six years, from 2006—which I believe is the date referred to by the Minister—to 2012. If in the mean time schools decide that they would like to switch over to the new regulations, they can review the situation from time to time. That is the essence of the proposal. We believe that the amendment is reasonable. We know that it would be received with a sigh of relief by some school governing bodies.
Amendment No. 36 amends the new regulations that have come into force. We discussed this at length in Committee. One of the points in relation to the new flexible regulations is that they attempt to cut down the number of stakeholder groups who form governing bodies.
Paragraph b on page 16 of the document, Policy Statements and Draft Regulations Supplied to Standing Committee G states:
The regulations will provide that at least one of the places for staff governors on school governing bodies should be provided by a teacher. The amendment suggests that, except for the smallest category of schools, "micro-schools"—we recognise that it is a bit much to expect that all members of staff in schools with only two or three staff members should be on the governing bodies—there should be separate representation by teacher governors and staff governors. That is precisely the aim of the amendment. I beg to move.
Baroness Blatch: My Lords, I support Amendments Nos. 35 and 36. The changes that were made for
The Lord Bishop of Blackburn: My Lords, I find myself rather torn on Amendment No. 35. I agree with what the noble Baroness, Lady Blatch, has just said about arrangements having been put in place, yet 10 years seems a long time and might pander to those governing bodies that most need to be changed. That is why I am hesitant about fixing a 10-year period in law. It would set in aspic the governing bodies that one would most like to adopt a new approach. I entirely support Amendment No. 36, provided that there is an adequate definition of the "smallest category of school".
Baroness Sharp of Guildford: My Lords, I remind the right reverend Prelate that the new governing rules came into effect only two years ago, so they have not been set in aspic for very long.
The Lord Bishop of Blackburn: My Lords, I was thinking about the end of the process in 2012, when I shall be in my bath chair, rather than the beginning of it. That is why I said that I was in some doubt as to how to respond to the amendment.
Baroness Ashton of Upholland: My Lords, I shall respond to the question of the noble Baroness, Lady Blatch, about the number of regulations. I apologise. I had meant to do that already. I have the information and I shall ensure that I pass it to her.
The fact that there will be regulations under the clauses on governance that we are about to debate does not mean that schools will be more regulated—quite the opposite. The regulations under these clauses replace many pages of primary legislation that we have repealed. Through these changes we shall simplify the rules, give schools greater flexibility and reduce the extent to which processes are regulated. My experience of discussing the issue with governing bodies is that they welcome the changes. That has been the response to my own consultation and the formal consultation.
I understand and agree that it would be helpful to governing bodies to have a reasonable period to choose a new constitutional model and have a new instrument of government in place. That is why The Way Forward consultation paper on school governance suggests giving governing bodies three years to implement the proposals.
As the noble Baroness, Lady Sharp, has said, we are committed to giving governing bodies until 1st September 2006 to have a new instrument of government in place. Our proposed time-scale for implementation offers flexibility that governors have told us that they want. It enables governing bodies to adopt a new constitutional model from September 2003 if that is what they want and it gives those
Governors have told us that the proposed timetable for implementation is helpful. We believe that three years is a reasonable length for a transition period. The amendment would mean that governing bodies could remain constituted under existing legislation, or reconstitute under the new proposals, for the next 10 years. Having two frameworks in place for such a long time would not be helpful. That has been confirmed by the responses to the consultation that we have received from governing bodies and from local education authorities. I therefore hope that the noble Baroness, Lady Sharp, will feel able to withdraw the amendment.
On Amendment No. 36, our proposal for school staff to be represented on the governing body as one stakeholder group received a high level of support. All governing bodies will be able to decide on the number of staff governors, up to and including a maximum of one-third of the places on the governing body. To safeguard teacher representation, we have said in our policy statement that regulations will prescribe that one place must be reserved for a teacher. Noble Lords might have seen from the draft regulations that where no teacher stands for election, the place can be taken by another member of staff. It is only by legislating in the way we propose that we can provide for that kind of flexibility.
All governing bodies will be able to choose a constitutional model that suits their needs best, within a framework of principles. A governing body cannot have fewer than nine governor places, or more than 20. Provided that governing bodies comply with the relevant principles, they are free to decide their own size and make-up.
There is a technical issue with the amendment in that there is no such concept as the "smallest category of school" in the new constitutional arrangements. There is no disagreement of principle. I have already said in Committee that I believe that support staff have a tremendously important role in schools. I therefore believe it is right that we are proposing a framework that allows for both teaching and other members of staff to be represented on the governing body as staff governors.
All governing bodies will be able to choose a model that allows support staff to be elected to the governing body as staff governors. If a governing body chooses a model of more than two staff members, it will be the electorate, which means all school staff, which will decide who it believes is best placed to be a staff governor.
I therefore hope that what I have said, together with the draft of the regulations, will satisfy the noble Baroness, Lady Sharp. If there are further points requiring clarification, I shall be more than happy to discuss them before Third Reading. Meanwhile, I hope that the noble Baroness will feel able to withdraw the amendment.
Baroness Sharp of Guildford: My Lords, I am grateful for the Minister's reply but I am a little disappointed by it. The notion of running the two models side by side is rather an innovative one that we should welcome. However, I am not surprised as I had rather expected the reply that I was given. As regards both Amendments Nos. 35 and 36, we need to go away and think about these matters a little more. We may return at Third Reading with some further proposals to see whether the Minister will regard them favourably on that occasion. For the moment, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
[Amendment No. 36 not moved.]
(1A) A governing body may resolve to retain the instrument of government in place on 1st September 2002 for a period of up to 10 years, and may review this decision from time to time."
"to implement the Government's commitment, the regulations must provide for at least one of the available vacancies to be provided by a teacher".
There is only one group for teachers and staff governors on governing bodies proposed under the new flexible regulations. That has caused a great deal of concern. The regulations of 1999, which were the result of lengthy discussions and consultation, finally found a separate place for support staff governors. Support staff governors have been delighted to have the extra place. The new flexible arrangements do not provide for a separate place for support staff governors.
10.30 p.m.
Next Section
Back to Table of Contents
Lords Hansard Home Page