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Lord Avebury: My Lords, can the Minister confirm that UNHCR already refers potentially suitable cases
under the mandate refugee scheme and that the UK is accepting something like 500 persons so nominated per annum? Will the new scheme be completely different? If so, how will it dovetail and what will be the initial numbers? Presumably they will be additional to the 500 refugees that we are already accepting.
Lord Bassam of Brighton: My Lords, it would not be proper for me to attempt to provide that level of detail because we have to work through some of the issues—particularly in consultation and discussion with the organisations to which I referred.
We hope that the UNHCR's role will include also conducting overall co-ordination of the global resettlement effort and advising us on best practice for our programme's operation. That would parallel the role that the UNHCR plays in resettlement programmes operated by other European countries.
Clause 58 already provides for all that to take place and allows the Secretary of State to fund projects managed by the UNHCR, should such an assignment of management responsibility occur. There is no need to duplicate that provision by making a specific reference in Clause 58(1)(e) to the UNHCR or projects involving that body. To create such duplication would undermine the need for brevity in legislation—something of which the House is often reminded—and possibly its accuracy, which is as important. The clause is primarily intended to provide the Secretary of State with flexibility in funding projects. As we intend to provide resettlement exceptionally, outside the rules, it is neither appropriate nor necessary that details of its operation appear in primary legislation. To do so would undermine the clause's flexibility, the programme's operation and the way in which we work with the UNHCR, NGOs and other international organisations.
Clause 58 is designed to support, not define, the design and implementation of the resettlement project. Continuing consultation with the UNHCR, expert bodies and experienced resettlement countries will inform its development so that we implement a model based on best practice. When developed, the detail of the programme will be publicly available as part of the immigration department's policy instructions and will be kept under close review, to take into account emerging experience and developments.
We fully understand the importance of the UNHCR being seen to be acting within its mandate when participating in a project of whatever type—as failure to act in accordance with the mandate may mean that the commission is acting unlawfully. However, whether or not the UNHCR is carrying out its protection mandate is ultimately for that body to judge. It is not something that can be affected, determined or achieved automatically by reference to a mandate in the clause.
I was asked whether people from Sangatte will be resettled under the scheme. The answer is no. Sangatte is subject to different arrangements. The noble Baroness, Lady Carnegy, asked whether legislation
would be needed to amend the plan. The resettlement scheme will be provided exceptionally outside the Immigration Rules, so the answer is no.
Baroness Carnegy of Lour: My Lords, my noble friend used her amendment to ask about the implications of the Home Office press release. Do the Government envisage implementing that press release and, if so, will they have to amend Clause 58? I understood the Minister to say that that would not be necessary.
Lord Bassam of Brighton: My Lords, my understanding is that will not be necessary.
As to numbers, we estimate something like 500 migrants per year. We do not yet know the source countries, but that will be determined over time and through consultation.
Lord Hylton: My Lords, before the Minister sits down, can he say whether the different arrangements regarding Sangatte will, in his opinion, lead to a real decrease in the number of people trying to enter this country illegally, at great risk to their own lives and causing great disruption to transport services?
6.30 p.m.
Lord Bassam of Brighton: My Lords, we are achieving greater and higher levels of co-operation with our colleagues in France. The arrangements we are putting in place in regard to Sangatte should deal more than adequately with the issues raised by the noble Lord. I hope that the answer to his question is yes.
I hope that I have dealt with the other points that were raised during the debate. If I have not and there are particular issues on which noble Lords require further information, I shall be more than happy to respond to them, perhaps through correspondence.
Baroness Anelay of St Johns: My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Hylton, for his contribution on the issue of numbers and for the later clarification that he sought from the Minister. I am grateful also to my noble friend Lady Carnegy for the important clarification that she obtained in regard to the Government's belief that there is no need to amend this clause in order to achieve the policy they set out in the press release on 7th October. I thank the Minister for giving me so little detail so courteously. I shall, of course, continue to pursue these matters. But this is a probing amendment and I do not intend to press it tonight.
It would appear that the House is being asked, in a sense, to give the Government a blank cheque in regard to this clause when the Government have said that they have not worked out the detail. Obviously I was being far too ingenuous in commenting in my opening remarks that I thought that the Government must have worked through the policy in great detail before launching it upon the unsuspecting world on 7th October. I got that totally wrong.
I am intrigued that the Minister said that the Government will be achieving different arrangements in regard to Sangatte. As he will expect, I shall seek to find out—perhaps through Written Questions—what on earth those different arrangements may be. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Clause 80 [Right of appeal: general]:
Lord Bassam of Brighton moved Amendment No. 19:
- Page 48, line 6, at end insert—
The noble Lord said: My Lords, this is genuinely a technical amendment. It seeks to ensure that where the Home Office curtails or revokes a person's leave to remain, the curtailment or revocation will not take effect until any appeal against it has been concluded. More explanation than that is not required. I have explained it as concisely as I can. I beg to move.
On Question, amendment agreed to.
Clause 81 [Appeal: claim for asylum]:
Lord Bassam of Brighton moved Amendment No. 20:
The noble Lord said: My Lords, in moving Amendment No. 20, I shall speak also to Amendments Nos. 22 and 23. Essentially, these are tidying amendments. In Committee, Clause 109 was amended to establish a definition of "asylum claim" for the whole of Part 5. I am advised that there is no need for a separate definition for the purposes of Clause 81. We simply propose to remove it. I beg to move.
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville: My Lords, I quite understand the amendment, but why does the title of the clause remain "claim for asylum"?
Lord Bassam of Brighton: My Lords, presumably because that is the issue covered by the clause.
On Question, amendment agreed to.
Lord Avebury moved Amendment No. 21:
The noble Lord said: My Lords, at the moment, the vast majority of people who are granted exceptional leave to remain for 28 days or more can appeal to an adjudicator to upgrade their status to that of a refugee. That gives them access to an independent evaluation of their claim and, if they are successful, to important benefits in terms of their immediate family reunion rights and settlement in the United Kingdom.
The courts have commented on a number of occasions on the benefits that refugee status confers over exceptional leave to remain, the most significant being that of family reunion. In the case of Saad,
I do not suppose that the Minister will give me what I am asking but, if he cannot accept the amendment, will he at least assure the House that where refugee status is refused but ELR is granted, full reasons for the refusal of refugee status and the grant of ELR will be given to the applicant? This is very important because, if the appeal is delayed for one year, as the Government plan, there will that much of a gap between the finding of the facts in the initial determination and the adjudication on those facts on appeal.
It would not be administratively difficult for the Government to do this because in many cases they already explain the decision to grant ELR—for example, where the Home Office first refuses a person's application for refugee status and then later a decision is made to grant ELR on the basis of subsequent representations.
When we discussed this matter in Committee, the noble Lord, Lord Filkin, said that it was a matter of clogging up the system: that if you had a significant number of cases of people applying for asylum—he gave the example of Kosovo in 1999—who are not found to qualify but are seen to have a right to exceptional leave to remain, such people would clog up the system, as the Minister put it, if it was necessary to test their appeals. That is the primary justification for putting these people in a position of not having a right of appeal for 12 months after they have been granted ELR.
However, reference has been made by the noble Baroness, Lady Anelay, to the growing practice of Ministers issuing policy through press release. In this case, we have the statement made by the Home Office on 7th October that it intends to,
If that is the case, we will not need to take precautions against those granted ELR continuing to enjoy the rights that they have already under the existing system of changing their status to that of refugee.
Moreover, we hope that there will not be cases such as Kosovo or Afghanistan—which is the other big example—where ELR was given on a country basis to anyone who applied, bearing in mind the impossibility of sending anyone back to those countries. If we do not have another Kosovo or Afghanistan situation, it is very difficult to envisage circumstances where the international community decides to restore the rights of people in a particular territory, and thus anyone coming from such territories who seeks asylum in this country may be seen to have a capacity to return within a measurable space of time. That is the kind of situation in which ELR is granted on a country basis, but we do not envisage that happening again in the future.
It is unsatisfactory that genuine refugees must reapply for asylum after a whole year on ELR. It will waste resources because it will put an additional administrative load on the Home Office to process asylum claims for a second time when they have been sitting on the shelf for the past 12 months. I hope that the Government will accept the amendment. I beg to move.
"(2A) A variation or revocation of the kind referred to in subsection (2)(e) or (f) shall not have effect while an appeal under subsection (1) against that variation or revocation—
(a) could be brought (ignoring any possibility of an appeal out of time with permission), or
(b) is pending."
Page 48, line 10, leave out "a claim for asylum" and insert "an asylum claim"
Page 48, line 13, leave out "one year" and insert "28 days"
"end the routine granting of Exceptional Leave to Remain . . . on a country basis, and review its use and scope to focus it on those who really need special humanitarian protection".
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