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Lord Davies of Oldham: My Lords, I am in great danger of straying from a Question on railways to deal with roads, and that would not be in the interests of the House.
Lord Dixon-Smith: My Lords, in the light of what the Minister has just said, does he not agree that it takes logic beyond reason when enhancing railway safety obliges more people to travel by road, where they are at greater risk?
Lord Davies of Oldham: My Lords, having been prompted twice, it is difficult to evade a question on roads as I have just done. Rail systems are infinitely safer than roads; therefore, any transfer from rail to road would increase accident rates. That is why we are concerned to improve railways, increase the number of rail passengers, and, so far as possible, transfer from road to rail. Noble Lords will recognise that there is a range of policies in that area, in which certain aspects of road policy may play their part.
Lord Clarke of Hampstead: My Lords, will my noble friend extend his last remark to the transfer of the carriage of Royal Mail freight on to the roads?
Lord Davies of Oldham: My Lords, as my noble friend will appreciate, that has been an issue of lively controversy over the past few months. He has taken joy in the fact that Royal Mail is looking at the issue again. It is for it to make the final judgment, but I am sure that it will bear in mind remarks from such an impeccable source.
Baroness O'Cathain: My Lords, in view of the Minister's remark that rail is the safest way of travelling, with which we all agree—at least, all the statistics show it to be so—what is the public's perception of the safety
and reliability of railways? This morning's seven o'clock news reported faults in Virgin trains meaning that the whole schedule would be disrupted. Then, at 11.30 a.m., in Westminster Tube station, it was announced that there were delays on five Underground lines because of problems. That is the perception, I am afraid. What are we doing about it?
Lord Davies of Oldham: My Lords, rail safety makes big news, and road safety does not. I am sure that all noble Lords have been on a motorway when an accident has happened, resulting in delays for hours. There is scarcely a line in the newspapers about such incidents, yet the same kind of difficulty on railways would occasion quite a splash. The noble Baroness is right that we must improve rail safety and the reliability of trains. Every such incident is to the disadvantage of rail. However, it will be recognised that many millions of our fellow citizens rely on the railway system, particularly commuters, who rely on it every day. They can distinguish between isolated incidents and the general safety and security in which they travel.
Lord Peston: My Lords, further to the noble Baroness's comment, will the noble Lord consider the possibility of reminding the public that nothing is perfectly safe and being alive is pretty dangerous in whatever form one cares to pursue life? Is it not the case that, if you stay at home, you will probably scald yourself with a kettle or something? The public need to know precisely that life is dangerous.
Lord Davies of Oldham: My Lords, I reassure my noble friend of one fact: life is a good deal safer on the Back Benches than it is on the Front Bench.
Lord Greaves: My Lords, are not InterCity trains, which reach speeds of 125 mph and sometimes faster, a potentially dangerous environment for passengers, who, quite rightly, may move about on them freely? Should not InterCity operators be required to provide adequate and clearly indicated first aid facilities on such trains and to have staff with first aid training?
Lord Davies of Oldham: My Lords, basic first aid is provided on such trains, and there are occasions when it is necessary. The noble Lord will recognise that, of all our transport systems, rail is many times safer than road, and InterCity trains are much safer than other trains because of their design for operating at higher speed. However, the noble Lord has a point. I shall check the extent to which first aid facilities are available on such trains.
Companies (Audit, Investigations and Community Enterprise) Bill [HL]
3.17 p.m.
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting: My Lords, on behalf of my noble friend Lord Sainsbury of Turville, I beg to introduce a Bill to amend the law relating to company auditors and accounts and company investigations, to
make provision for community interest companies, and for connected purposes. I beg to move that this Bill be now read a first time.Moved, That the Bill be now read a first time.—(Lord Evans of Temple Guiting.)
On Question, Bill read a first time, and ordered to be printed.
Constitution Committee
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform
Liaison Committee
Privileges
Science and Technology
3.18 p.m.
The Chairman of Committees (Lord Brabazon of Tara): My Lords, I beg to move the five Motions standing in my name on the Order Paper en bloc.
Moved, That a Select Committee be appointed to examine the constitutional implications of all public Bills coming before the House; and to keep under review the operation of the constitution;
That, as proposed by the Committee of Selection, the following Lords be named of the committee:
L. MacGregor of Pulham Market,
L. Norton of Louth (Chairman);
That the committee have power to appoint specialist advisers;
That the committee have power to adjourn from place to place;
That the committee have leave to report from time to time;
That the minutes of evidence taken before the Constitution Committee in the last session of Parliament be referred to the committee;
That the minutes of evidence taken before the committee from time to time shall, if the committee think fit, be printed. Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform
Moved, That a Select Committee be appointed to report whether the provisions of any Bill inappropriately delegate legislative power, or whether they subject the exercise of legislative power to an inappropriate degree of parliamentary scrutiny; to report on documents and draft orders laid before Parliament under the Regulatory Reform Act 2001; and to perform, in respect of such documents and orders and subordinate provisions orders laid under that Act, the functions performed in respect of other instruments by the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments;
That, as proposed by the Committee of Selection, the following Lords be named of the committee:
L. Brooke of Sutton Mandeville,
That the committee have power to adjourn from place to place within the United Kingdom;
That the committee have power to appoint specialist advisers.
Moved, That a Select Committee be appointed to advise the House on the resources required for Select Committee work and to allocate resources between Select Committees; to review the Select Committee work of the House; to consider requests for ad hoc committees and report to the House with recommendations; to ensure effective co-ordination between the two Houses; and to consider the availability of Lords to serve on committees;
That, as proposed by the Committee of Selection, the following Lords together with the Chairman of Committees be named of the committee:
That the committee have leave to report from time to time;
That the committee have power to appoint specialist advisers.
Moved, That a Committee for Privileges be appointed and that, as proposed by the Committee of Selection, the following Lords together with the Chairman of Committees and any four Lords of Appeal be named of the committee:
That the committee have power to appoint sub-committees and that such sub-committees have power to appoint their own chairman;
That the committee have power to co-opt any Lord for the purposes of serving on any sub-committee. Science and Technology
Moved, That a Select Committee be appointed to consider science and technology and that, as proposed by the Committee of Selection, the following Lords be named of the Select Committee:
That the committee have power to appoint sub-committees and that the committee have power to appoint the chairmen of sub-committees;
That the committee have power to co-opt any Lord for the purposes of serving on the committee or any sub-committee;
That the committee have leave to report from time to time;
That the committee and any sub-committee have power to adjourn from place to place;
That the committee and any sub-committee have power to appoint specialist advisers;
That the minutes of evidence taken before the Science and Technology Committee or any sub-committee in the last session of Parliament be referred to the committee;
That the minutes of evidence taken before the committee from time to time shall, if the committee think fit, be printed.—(The Chairman of Committees.)
On Question, Motion agreed to.
Personal Statement: The Lord Falconer of Thoroton
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