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Baroness Hanham: My Lords, I am absolutely fascinated by the Minister's response. One of the examples he mentioned would be a failure to conform to the regional spatial strategy. We have just discussed at length how that is to be only a "general conformity". Now we must refer back to exactly what kind of conformity to the regional spatial strategy is required. If the local authority does not conform, or generally conform, it will be open to the Secretary of State to intervene because it has not done so.
It appears that Amendment No. 96, which I moved prior to this one, touched the edge of a problem here. The position is exactly as I said it was: the general conformity is in fact a conformity. Having said that, and having listened to the Minister's response on the other matters, I make no further comment. However, I am fascinated by his first response. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
[Amendments Nos. 100 to 103 not moved.]
Clause 28 [Joint local development documents]:
[Amendment No. 104 not moved.]
Clause 33 [Urban development corporations]:
[Amendment No. 105 not moved.]
Clause 35 [Annual monitoring report]:
Baroness Hanham moved Amendment No. 106:
- Leave out Clause 35.
The noble Baroness said: Amendment No. 106 proposes that Clause 35 should be left out of the Bill. The clause requires local planning authorities to report annually to the Secretary of State on the implementation of their local development schemes, and whether the policies set out in the local development documents are being achieved. The clause also provides for the Secretary of State to make regulations prescribing what information an annual report must contain, the period it must cover—presumably one year—when it must be made and the form it must take. I really cannot see what useful purpose this clause or an annual report serve. We have here expressed, once again, the theme of the Government keeping an eye on local government.
The clause would ensure that every 12 months, each planning authority writes to the Secretary of State setting out how it has progressed on its local development schemes, detailing how the policies in the local development document are being achieved. The reports will be more of those glossy documents with which we are all becoming so familiar, the expense of which must now be mounting into the zillions. Every single public authority is producing annual reports in all directions. I am in the health service and I know how many annual reports in the form of glossy documents are being produced.
How much and what will the Secretary of State do with such annual reports? I understand that the whole purpose of the development plan process is to keep things moving and to hold reviews regularly. To produce an annual report simply marks yet another interception in the life of planning officers, who at the best of times are few and far between and will now have to set to and produce yet another monitoring document—because that is all it will be. Further, most annual reports tend to put a glossy face on what is being done. This will be another example of that practice.
The requirement will be an onerous burden, time-consuming, producing yet more administration and costly. I would prefer to see the provision removed, but if the Minister feels that it is vital perhaps he will justify
its inclusion. In other areas of legislation, I know that my noble friends have argued that the Secretary of State should draw up an annual report on the workings of new legislation, such as the licensing Bill and the extradition Bill. The Government have answered that that would be burdensome and expensive. We ought to turn the turtle over and say that if it is expensive for the Secretary of State and the Government, it is expensive and unnecessary for others as well.4.30 p.m.
Lord Marlesford: My Lords, one knows that the Government pay lip-service to reducing the administrative burden and the causes of unnecessary expenditure, and so on. How is it—I think that I can understand how it is—that Ministers let this clause slip by when the bureaucrats inevitably wanted to put it in? The bureaucrats want as much paper as can be produced on everything all the time.
This is an additional burden. It is not a report to the people but to the bureaucrats in the department, who will be fully aware of what each local authority is doing. It is quite unnecessary and as the noble Baroness, Lady Hanham, said, there is a real shortage of staff, partly because they are scarce and partly because of resources. There is a real shortage of competent planning staff in local authorities. It is intolerable that the Government should propose something so totally useless and ultimately bureaucratic. I hope that the Minister will have no problem in accepting the amendment.
Lord Rooker: My Lords, I am persuaded that the measure is red tape; there is no question about that. One has only to look at it and ask oneself what purpose it would serve and how much it would cost. I hope that there would not be glossy reports—there would not have to be. It is probably red tape, though I would not say "burdensome" red tape because I do not actually know.
If that was all that I had to say, then clearly we would accept the amendment. However, there is a problem. I remember saying this in Committee, so it cannot be new to the noble Baroness, Lady Hanham. The monitoring requirements in the clause and the regulations are not new. The work is being done now by most local authorities. All that the measure does is to formalise that practice, making it part of the new system and the effective implementation of the new development plans.
That being said, I have to resist the amendment. I cannot rewrite the Bill on my feet—I am not the planning Minister—so I must be careful here. I am making the case for keeping the clause in the Bill because it does not impose a new burden. The work is already done by most local authorities. I would like to try to satisfy noble Lords, perhaps by letter, that it is not a new burden for most local authorities because they are already doing it now. If we had invented the practice from scratch it would, as the noble Lord, Lord Marlesford says, be a lot of red tape occupying planning officers when there are better ways for them
to spend their time. However, it is not a new burden or requirement and so I must resist the amendment. I will seek further information for Third Reading.
Lord Marlesford: My Lords, to remove existing burdens is a merit in government. The Minister ought to remove the clause now with the proviso that the matter should be looked at again, so that, if we really think there has to be something like this measure, we can bring it back again.
Lord Cobbold: My Lords, the purpose of the Bill is to simplify the planning process and this is a wonderful opportunity to do that.
Lord Avebury: My Lords, will the Minister say either now or on Third Reading whether local authorities will be able to submit this information electronically to the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister?
Lord Rooker: My Lords, if they cannot then we will have failed with e-government. I am getting in real trouble here. I have no authority to accept the amendment. What is more, there are some things that I might go to the stake for, but I am not going to the stake for this. I take the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Marlesford. I am arguing the case for the status quo while he is arguing that this is a chance to get rid of some red tape. The local authorities do it now when they are not required to do it. One has to ask oneself why they are doing it. There is probably a good and useful purpose for which this work is carried out. It is important to monitor the best practice and what is actually happening.
When we were debating another provision of the Bill I referred to a list of 29 local authorities which had not completed a development plan in 14 years. A small minority are not conforming to best practice. The rest are doing the work and on that basis the measure will not impose an extra burden. I will make it my business to check that it does not and get confirmation that local authorities will be able to deal with these plans electronically. That way there would be no excuse whatsoever for publishing a glossy report.
Baroness Hanham: My Lords, I always like the Minister when he is just about tempted to foul up his own notes and everybody else's. I am grateful to him because he is honest enough to acknowledge when things are getting ridiculous. I suppose that I ought to take comfort from the fact that "annual report" does not have a capital A and a capital R, which would imply a glossy report.
At the moment local authorities make annual returns to the department on the number of planning applications being dealt with, the time they have taken, and so on. However, at present, they certainly do not report on the implementation of the local development scheme, because it is not there. As I understand it, there is no requirement for a return on the unitary development plan. It may be that there is, but if there is not, there is no justification for putting this extra burden on local authorities because there will be a new
framework for documents. Indeed, some local authorities' report on the local development scheme might simply be to say that they have not done it, because for the first three years they will not have to.It would be helpful if we were to return to this matter. I agree that it is not the most important part of the Bill, but it is an important aspect. If we were to return to it at Third Reading, perhaps the Minister might be in a position to say either that he believes that the whole thing is a bureaucratic nightmare or that the detail that will be required justifies the use of the description "annual report" rather than "annual return". I will come back to this matter, but in the mean while I thank the Minister for having shown some scepticism about it as well.
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
[Amendment No. 107 not moved.]
Clause 38 [Development plan]:
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