Previous Section Back to Table of Contents Lords Hansard Home Page

Baroness Scotland of Asthal: I share the noble Duke's desire to protect children and vulnerable adults, so I understand why these amendments have been tabled. However, they do not achieve the effect desired either by the Law Society of Scotland or by the noble Duke.

Clause 158 of the Bill amends Part 5 of the Police Act 1997, which governs access to criminal records for employment vetting purposes and repeals the provisions which the amendment seeks to amend. Clause 158 changes the way in which eligibility for enhanced disclosure is governed and under those provisions it will be for the Scottish Ministers to determine, by order, the categories of persons eligible to apply for an enhanced disclosure.

In making regulations under Part 5 of the 1997 Act, I am sure that Scottish Ministers will take account of the representations put to them by the Law Society of Scotland in relation to particular groups, including precognition agents. So the route that the noble Duke and the Law Society want is there in the Bill.

Amendments Nos. 225 and 228 seek to exempt trainee solicitors who are carrying out precognitions, or undertaking private investigation work, from the requirement to obtain an SIA licence and would bring them into line with the exemptions for qualified solicitors and advocates. While I share the noble Duke's concern that trainee solicitors should be provided with full and comprehensive training, we do not agree that these amendments are required to ensure that.

When developing the detailed arrangements for the regulation of private investigators and precognition agents, I am sure that the SIA will liaise with the Law Society of Scotland to take into account the need for trainee solicitors who are planning to work in these areas to receive the necessary training without imposing any unnecessary regulatory burdens.

Amendment No. 229 is also unnecessary. A door supervisor's licence is a particular type of SIA licence designed to regulate people who have responsibility for security and conflict management in places such as pubs and clubs. Such a licence would not be necessary for a security guard working in an off-licence. A security guard employed under contract at an off-licence would require an SIA security guard licence, which would address the specific training requirements for this group of people. Furthermore, it would be an
5 Apr 2005 : Column 710
unnecessary regulatory burden to impose these additional requirements on off-licensed premises in Scotland only.

I hope that I have been able to explain why the amendments are not necessary, although I understand why the noble Duke raised them.

11 p.m.

The Duke of Montrose: I thank the Minister for that very full explanation, first, on Amendment No. 218 and, latterly, on Amendment No. 225 and the others in the group. In the light of her explanation, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Baroness Scotland of Asthal moved Amendments Nos. 219 to 224:

(f) in subsection (5)(b), at the end add "(or where the order is, or regulations are, made by the Scottish Ministers, as the Scottish Ministers think fit)""
Page 236, line 1, leave out from beginning to "after" and insert—
"11 In section 26 (short title, commencement and extent)—
(a) after subsection (2) insert—
"(2A) In the application of this Act to Scotland—
(a) the reference in subsection (2) to the Secretary of State must be construed as a reference to the Scottish Ministers; but
(b) before making any order under subsection (2) the Scottish Ministers are to consult the Secretary of State."; and.
(b) in subsection (4),"

On Question, amendments agreed to.

[Amendments Nos. 225 to 229 not moved.]

Schedule 16, as amended, agreed to.

Clause 167 [Orders and regulations]:

[Amendment No. 230 not moved.]

Baroness Scotland of Asthal moved Amendment No. 231:

"( ) any order under section 50;"

The noble Baroness said: In moving Amendment No. 231, I shall speak also to Amendment No. 232. I shall be brief. These two amendments give effect to the one recommendation in the Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee's report on Part 1 of the Bill. The Government are happy to accept the
5 Apr 2005 : Column 711
committee's view that the order-making power in Clause 50 should be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure. I beg to move.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Baroness Scotland of Asthal moved Amendment No. 232:

"( ) any order under section 50;"

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Clause 167, as amended, agreed to.

Clauses 168 and 169 agreed to.

Schedule 17 agreed to.

Schedule 18 [Repeals and revocations]:

Baroness Scotland of Asthal moved Amendments Nos. 233 to 236:

"Unlawful Drilling Act 1819(60 Geo. 3 & 1 Geo. 4c. 1)In section 2, the words ", or for any other person acting in their aid or assistance,".
Vagrancy Act 1824 (c. 83)Section 6.
Railway Regulation Act 1842(c. 55)Section 17.
Companies ClausesConsolidation Act 1845(c. 16)In section 156, the words ", and all persons called by him to his assistance,".
Railways ClausesConsolidation Act 1845(c. 20)Sections 104 and 154.
Licensing Act 1872 (c. 94)In section 12, the words "may be apprehended and"."

London County Council(General Powers) Act 1900(c. cclxviii)
In section 27, the words "and any person called to the assistance of such constable or officer".
Licensing Act 1902 (c. 28)
In section 1, the words"apprehended and".
In section 2(1), the words "may be apprehended, and"."

Page 240, line 17, at end insert—
"Criminal Justice Act 1967(c. 80)In section 91(1), the words "may be arrested without warrant by any person and"."

On Question, amendments agreed to.
5 Apr 2005 : Column 712

Baroness Scotland of Asthal moved Amendment No. 237:

"In Schedule 1, in paragraph 14(a), the words "to which the application relates"."

The noble Baroness said: This is a minor technical amendment. It simply reflects in the repeals schedule a repeal to Schedule 1 to the Police and Criminal Evidence Act already provided for in subsection (15) of Clause 109. I beg to move.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Baroness Scotland of Asthal moved Amendments Nos. 238 to 241:

"Football (Offences) Act 1991(c. 19)Section 5(1)."

"Transport and Works Act1992 (c. 42)Section 30(1) and (3).
Section 40."

"Section 155.Section 166(4).Section 167(7)."

"Offensive Weapons Act 1996(c. 26)Section 1(1)."

On Question, amendments agreed to.

[Amendment No. 241A not moved.]

Next Section Back to Table of Contents Lords Hansard Home Page