House of Lords Journal 238 (Session 2004-05)


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Page 337

2004-05

Volume 238      

Monday 21st March 2005

The House met at half-past two o’clock.

The following Lords Spiritual and Temporal were present:

Falconer of Thoroton, L.
(Lord Chancellor)

Ackner, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Alliance, L.
Alton of Liverpool, L.
Amos, B.
Ampthill, L.
Andrews, B.
Anelay of St Johns, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Arran, E.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Ashton of Upholland, B.
Astor of Hever, L.
Attlee, E.
Avebury, L.
Bach, L.
Baker of Dorking, L.
Ballyedmond, L.
Barker, B.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Best, L.
Bhatia, L.
Bhattacharyya, L.
Biffen, L.
Billingham, B.
Birt, L.
Blackstone, B.
Blackwell, L.
Blaker, L.
Bledisloe, V.
Blood, B.
Bonham-Carter of Yarnbury, B.
Boothroyd, B.
Borrie, L.
Boston of Faversham, L.
Bowness, L.
Brabazon of Tara, L.
Bradshaw, L.
Bragg, L.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Bridges, L.
Brightman, L.
Brittan of Spennithorne, L.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Brooke of Sutton Mandeville, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Burlison, L.
Burns, L.
Buscombe, B.
Byford, B.
Cameron of Dillington, L.
Cameron of Lochbroom, L.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Campbell-Savours, L.
Carlile of Bucklow, L.
Carrington, L.
Carter, L.
Chadlington, L.
Chalker of Wallasey, B.
Chandos, V.
Chilver, L.
Chorley, L.
Christopher, L.
Clark of Windermere, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Cobbold, L.
Cockfield, L.
Cohen of Pimlico, B.
Colville of Culross, V.
Colwyn, L.
Condon, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L.
Corbett of Castle Vale, L.
Courtown, E.
Cox, B.
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Crawford and Balcarres, E.
Crawley, B.
Crickhowell, L.
Cuckney, L.
Cumberlege, B.
Darcy de Knayth, B.
David, B.
Davies of Coity, L.
Davies of Oldham, L.
De Mauley, L.
Dean of Thornton-le-Fylde, B.
Dearing, L.
Denham, L.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dixon, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Donaldson of Lymington, L.
Donoughue, L.
Drayson, L.
D’Souza, B.
Dubs, L.
Dundee, E.
Dykes, L.
Eames, L.
Eatwell, L.
Eccles of Moulton, B.
Eden of Winton, L.
Elder, L.
Elis-Thomas, L.
Elles, B.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Elystan-Morgan, L.
Erroll, E.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Ezra, L.
Falkender, B.
Falkland, V.
Falkner of Margravine, B.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Fearn, L.
Fellowes, L.
Ferrers, E.
Filkin, L.
Fitt, L.
Flather, B.
Fookes, B.
Forsyth of Drumlean, L.
Fowler, L.
Fraser of Carmyllie, L.
Freeman, L.
Freyberg, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Garden, L.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Geddes, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Giddens, L.
Gilmour of Craigmillar, L.
Glentoran, L.
Goff of Chieveley, L.
Golding, B.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Goschen, V.
Goudie, B.
Gould of Brookwood, L.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Grantchester, L.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greengross, B.
Greenway, L.
Gregson, L.
Griffiths of Burry Port, L.
Grocott, L.
Hamwee, B.
Hanham, B.
Hannay of Chiswick, L.
Hanningfield, L.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Peckham, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.

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Harrison, L.
Hart of Chilton, L.
Haskel, L.
Haworth, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Hayman, B.
Henig, B.
Henley, L.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hodgson of Astley Abbotts, L.
Hogg, B.
Hogg of Cumbernauld, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Holme of Cheltenham, L.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Howard of Rising, L.
Howe, E.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Howe of Idlicote, B.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Hylton, L.
Inglewood, L.
Irvine of Lairg, L.
James of Holland Park, B.
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
Jellicoe, E.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Joffe, L.
Jones, L.
Jopling, L.
Jordan, L.
Kalms, L.
Kennedy of The Shaws, B.
Kilclooney, L.
Kimball, L.
King of Bridgwater, L.
King of West Bromwich, L.
Kingsland, L.
Kirkham, L.
Kirkhill, L.
Knight of Collingtree, B.
Laing of Dunphail, L.
Laird, L.
Laming, L.
Lane of Horsell, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Lawson of Blaby, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Leitch, L.
Lester of Herne Hill, L.
Lewis of Newnham, L.
Lipsey, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, Bp.
Liverpool, E.
Livsey of Talgarth, L.
Lloyd of Berwick, L.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
London, Bp.
Lucas, L.
Ludford, B.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
McDonagh, B.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
MacGregor of Pulham Market, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
McIntosh of Hudnall, B.
Mackay of Clashfern, L.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
McKenzie of Luton, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
MacLaurin of Knebworth, L.
Maclennan of Rogart, L.
McNally, L.
Maginnis of Drumglass, L.
Mancroft, L.
Mar, C.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Marlesford, L.
Marsh, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Maxton, L.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Merlyn-Rees, L.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Miller of Hendon, B.
Molyneaux of Killead, L.
Monro of Langholm, L.
Monson, L.
Montagu of Beaulieu, L.
Montrose, D.
Moore of Wolvercote, L.
Morgan, L.
Morgan of Drefelin, B.
Morgan of Huyton, B.
Morris of Aberavon, L.
Morris of Bolton, B.
Morris of Manchester, L.
Moser, L.
Mowbray and Stourton, L.
Moynihan, L.
Murphy, B.
Murton of Lindisfarne, L.
Naseby, L.
Neill of Bladen, L.
Neuberger, B.
Newby, L.
Newton of Braintree, L.
Noakes, B.
Northbourne, L.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Northover, B.
Norton of Louth, L.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
O’Cathain, B.
O’Neill of Bengarve, B.
Onslow, E.
Oppenheim-Barnes, B.
Ouseley, L.
Palmer, L.
Palumbo, L.
Parekh, L.
Patel, L.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Patten, L.
Paul, L.
Pearson of Rannoch, L.
Peel, E.
Pendry, L.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Peston, L.
Peyton of Yeovil, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Platt of Writtle, B.
Plumb, L.
Ponsonby of Shulbrede, L.
Prashar, B.
Prior, L.
Prosser, B.
Prys-Davies, L.
Puttnam, L.
Quinton, L.
Quirk, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Rawlings, B.
Razzall, L.
Rea, L.
Reay, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rees, L.
Rees-Mogg, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Rennard, L.
Renton, L.
Renton of Mount Harry, L.
Richard, L.
Richardson of Calow, B.
Roberts of Conwy, L.
Roberts of Llandudno, L.
Robertson of Port Ellen, L.
Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Rogan, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Rooker, L.
Roper, L.
Rosser, L.
Rosslyn, E.
Rotherwick, L.
Rowlands, L.
Royall of Blaisdon, B.
Russell-Johnston, L.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
Saatchi, L.
Sainsbury of Preston Candover, L.
Sainsbury of Turville, L.
St. John of Bletso, L.
St John of Fawsley, L.
Saltoun of Abernethy, Ly.
Sandberg, L.
Sandwich, E.
Sawyer, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Seccombe, B.
Selborne, E.
Sewel, L.
Sharman, L.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
Sharples, B.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Sheldon, L.

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Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Skelmersdale, L.
Skidelsky, L.
Slim, V.
Smith of Clifton, L.
Smith of Gilmorehill, B.
Snape, L.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Southwark, Bp.
Steel of Aikwood, L.
Stern, B.
Stewartby, L.
Stoddart of Swindon, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strabolgi, L.
Strathclyde, L.
Swinfen, L.
Symons of Vernham Dean, B.
Tanlaw, L.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Taylor of Warwick, L.
Tebbit, L.
Temple-Morris, L.
Tenby, V.
Thatcher, B.
Thomas of Gresford, L.
Thomas of Macclesfield, L.
Thomas of Swynnerton, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B.
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Thornton, B.
Tombs, L.
Tomlinson, L.
Tope, L.
Tordoff, L.
Trefgarne, L.
Triesman, L.
Trumpington, B.
Truscott, L.
Tugendhat, L.
Tunnicliffe, L.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Varley, L.
Waddington, L.
Wade of Chorlton, L.
Wakeham, L.
Wall of New Barnet, B.
Wallace of Saltaire, L.
Walmsley, B.
Walpole, L.
Warnock, B.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Watson of Invergowrie, L.
Watson of Richmond, L.
Wedderburn of Charlton, L.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wilcox, B.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Crosby, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williamson of Horton, L.
Wilson of Tillyorn, L.
Windlesham, L.
Wolfson, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Norwood Green, L.

PRAYERS were read by the Lord Bishop of Liverpool.

Judicial Business

1.Kirin-Amgen Inc and others (Appellants) v. Hoechst Marion Roussel Limited and others (Respondents)—
2.Kirin-Amgen Inc and others (Respondents) v. Hoechst Marion Roussel Limited and others (Appellants)—

(Conjoined Appeals)—

Further to the Judgment of the House of 21st October (55th Report from the Appellate Committee, [2004] UKHL 46), it was ordered that the Orders of Mr. Justice Neuberger in the High Court (Chancery Division) (Patents Court) of 3rd May 2001, 16th May 2001, 8th August 2001, 13th September 2001 and 18th April 2002 and the Order of the Court of Appeal of 27th March 2003 be set aside so far as they relate to costs (save for paragraphs 7 and 8 of the Order of Mr. Justice Neuberger of 18th April 2002, as set out below); that paragraphs 7 and 8 of the Order of Mr. Justice Neuberger in the High Court (Chancery Division) (Patents Court) of 18th April 2002 be affirmed; that Hoechst Marion Roussel Limited, Hoechst Marion Roussel Inc. and Transkaryotic Therapies Inc. do pay to Kirin-Amgen Inc., Ortho Biotech Inc. and Ortho Biotech Products LP their costs of the appeal from the judgment of Mr. Justice Neuberger of 21st March 2002; that Kirin-Amgen Inc., Ortho Biotech Inc. and Ortho Biotech Products LP do pay to Hoechst Marion Roussel Limited, Hoechst Marion Roussell Inc. and Transkaryotic Therapies Inc. their costs in this House and 90% of their costs in the High Court (Chancery Division) (Patents Court) and the Court of Appeal other than the costs in paragraphs 7 and 8 of the Order of Mr. Justice Neuberger and the costs of the appeal from the judgment of Mr. Justice Neuberger of 21st March 2002 as set out above; that the amounts thereof be determined by a Costs Judge for those costs incurred in the High Court and the Court of Appeal and certified by the Clerk of the Parliaments for those incurred in this House; that European Patent (UK) No. 0 148 605 be amended by the deletion of paragraphs 19 to 26, 29 and 31 of the summary on pages 8 and 9 and claims 19 to 26, 29 and 31; that the remaining paragraphs and claims and references to them be renumbered accordingly; and that the advertisement of the said amendments be dispensed with.

3.Regina v. Secretary of State for the Home Department (Respondent) ex parte Greenfield (FC) (Appellant)—Further to the Order of the House of Wednesday 16th February 2005 (22nd Report from the Appellate Committee, Session 2004–05 [2005] UKHL 14), it was ordered that the respondent do pay or cause to be paid to the appellant his costs incurred in the Divisional Court of Her Majesty’s High Court of Justice Queen’s Bench Division and in Her Majesty’s Court of Appeal and that the amount of such costs be determined by a Costs Judge; that the appellant do pay or cause to be paid to the respondent his costs in this House and that the amount of such costs, if any, to be paid by the appellant and to be paid out of the Community Legal Service Fund be certified by the Clerk of the Parliaments in accordance with section 11 of the Access to Justice Act 1999; and that the costs of the appellant in this House be taxed in accordance with the Access to Justice Act 1999.

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4.Regina v. Parole Board (Respondents) ex parte West (FC) (Appellant)—Further to the Order of the House of Thursday 27th January 2005 (9th Report from the Appellate Committee, Session 2004–05 [2005] UKHL 1), it was ordered that the respondents do pay to the appellant his costs incurred before Mr Justice Turner and on the application for permission to appeal to Her Majesty’s Court of Appeal (up to and including 20th June 2002 when permission to appeal was granted); that the respondents do pay to the appellant half of his costs incurred before this House and that the amount of such last-mentioned costs be certified by the Clerk of the Parliaments in accordance with section 11 of the Access to Justice Act 1999; and that the costs of the appellant be taxed in accordance with the Access to Justice Act 1999.
5.Regina v. Smith (Appellant) (2004) (No. 2) (On Appeal from the Court of Appeal (Criminal Division))—Further to the Order of the House of Wednesday 16th February 2005 (20th Report from the Appellate Committee, Session 2004–05 [2005] UKHL 12), it was ordered that the costs of the appellant Smith in the Court of Appeal Criminal Division and in this House be paid out of central funds in accordance with s.16 (5)(d) of the Prosecution of Offences Act 1985, the amount of such costs in this House to be certified by the Clerk of the Parliaments.
6.Robertson and others (Petitioners) v. Department of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Respondents)—The petition of Guy Robertson, Mark Alexander, Simon Harland, Mark Holder, James Windebank and Simon Huish praying for leave to appeal was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.
7.O’Connell (Petitioner) v. Ipswich Crown Court (Respondents)—The petition of Shaun Paul O’Connell praying for leave to appeal was presented without payment of the fee, such fee having been waived by the Appeal Committee pursuant to Standing Order XIII; the said petition was referred to an Appeal Committee (lodged 16th March).
8.Regina v. Secretary of State for the Home Department (Appellant) ex parte Adam (FC) (Respondent)—
9.Regina v. Secretary of State for the Home Department (Appellant) ex parte Tesema (Respondent)—
10.Regina v. Secretary of State for the Home Department (Appellant) ex parte Limbuela (Respondent)—

(Conjoined Appeals)—

The petition of the National Council for Civil Liberties and Justice praying for leave to intervene in the said appeals was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.

11.London Diocesan Fund and others and others (Respondents) v. Avonridge Property Company Limited (Appellants)—The appeal was set down for hearing and referred to an Appellate Committee.
12.Sutradhar (FC) (Appellant) v. Natural Environment Research Council (Respondents)—The appeal was set down for hearing and referred to an Appellate Committee.
13.Powerhouse Retail Limited and others (Respondents) v. Burroughs and others (Appellants)—The petition of the appellants praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 20th April (the agents for the respondents consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed.
14.Ali (FC) (Respondent) v. Headteacher and Governors of Lord Grey School (Appellants)—The respondent now consenting to the petition praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 12th April, it was ordered as prayed.

Papers

15.Command Papers—The following papers were presented to the House by command of Her Majesty and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.Prisons—Government Reply to the First Report from the House of Commons Home Affairs Committee Session 2004–05 on Rehabilitation of Prisoners; (6486)
2.Health—Government Report on Independence, Well-being and Choice—Our vision for the future of social care for adults in England: Government consultation document; (6499)
3.Civil List—Pensions for 2004–2005, laid under the Civil List Act 1972. (—)
16.Statutory Instruments (Standing Order 71)—The following negative instruments, having been laid before the House on 18th March 2005, were ordered to lie on the Table:
1. (i) Social Security Benefits Up-rating Regulations 2005— (632)

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(ii) Social Security (Industrial Injuries) (Dependency) (Permitted Earnings Limits) Order 2005—(633)
 laid under the Social Security Contributions and Benefits Act 1992;
2.National Assistance (Sums for Personal Requirements and Assessment of Resources) (Amendment) (England) Regulations 2005, laid under the National Assistance Act 1948; (708)
3. (i) Pensions Regulator Tribunal (Legal Assistance Scheme) Regulations 2005— (781)
(ii) Pensions Regulator Tribunal (Legal Assistance Scheme - Costs) Regulations 2005—(782)
 laid under the Pensions Act 2004;
4.Tax Credits Notification of Changes of Circumstances (Civil Partnership) (Transitional Provisions) Order 2005, laid under the Civil Partnership Act 2004. (828)
17.Negative Instruments—The following instruments were laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.Local Authorities (Categorisation) (England) Order 2005, laid under the Local Government Act 2003; (694)
2.Occupational Pension Schemes (Independent Trustee) Regulations 2005, laid under the Pension Schemes Act 1993; (703)
3.Contaminants in Food (England) (Amendment) Regulations 2005, laid under the Food Safety Act 1990; (775)
4.Social Security (Claims and Payments) Amendment (No. 2) Regulations 2005, laid under the Social Security Administration Act 1992; (777)
5.Road Traffic (Permitted Parking Area and Special Parking Area) (County of Hertfordshire) (District of Welwyn Hatfield) Order 2005, laid under the Road Traffic Act 1991; (779)
6.Crime Prevention (Designated Areas) Order 2005, laid under the Highways Act 1980; (829)
7.Pensions Increase (Review) Order 2005, laid under the Social Security Pensions Act 1975; (858)
8.Revision of Statutes made by Wolfson College, Cambridge, laid under the Universities of Oxford
and Cambridge Act 1923.
(—)
18.Papers not subject to parliamentary proceedings—The following papers were laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:
1. (i)Report and Accounts for 2002–03 of the Central Police Training and Development Authority—
(ii)Report and Accounts for 2003–04 of the Central Police Training and Development Authority—
 laid under the Criminal Justice and Police Act 2001;
2.Accounts for 2003–04 of the Grants and Loans to the Housing Action Trusts, together with the Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General, laid under the Housing Act 1988;
3.Law Commission: Ninth Programme of Law Reform, laid under the Law Commission Act 1965;
4.Business Plan for 2004–05 of the Northern Ireland Legal Services Commission, laid under the Access to Justice (Northern Ireland) Order 2003;
5.Accounts for 2003–04 of the Public Health Laboratory Service Board, together with the Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General, laid under the National Health Service Act 1977;
6.Report and Accounts for 2003-04 of the Equality Commission for Northern Ireland, laid under the Northern Ireland Act 1998.

Select Committee Reports

19.Science and Technology—The 2nd Report from the Select Committee, Radioactive Waste Management: Government Response, was made and ordered to be printed. (HL Paper 89)
20.Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform—The following reports from the Select Committee were made and ordered to be printed:

15th Report, on the following bills:

Serious Organised Crime and Police Bill;

Mental Capacity Bill—Government amendment for Third Reading; (HL Paper 90)

16th Report, on the Draft Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005. (HL Paper 91)

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Public Business

21.Business of the House—It was moved by the Lord President (Baroness Amos) that the following Unstarred Question be referred to a Grand Committee—

The Countess of Mar—To ask Her Majesty’s Government whether they will reconsider their policy on bovine tuberculosis in light of concerns expressed by more than 350 veterinary surgeons to the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs about the spread of the disease;

the motion was agreed to.

22.New Opportunities Fund (Specification of Initiative) Order 2005—It was moved by the Lord President (Baroness Amos) that the draft Order be referred to a Grand Committee; the motion was agreed to.
23.Contracting Out (Functions in Relation to Cultural Objects) Order 2005—It was moved by the Lord President (Baroness Amos) that the draft Order be referred to a Grand Committee; the motion was agreed to.
24.Constitutional Reform Bill [HL]—The Commons amendments were considered; motions that the House do disagree with certain Commons amendments were disagreed to (see division lists 1 and 2); then the Commons amendments were agreed to; further Commons amendments were agreed to.
25.Identity Cards Bill—It was moved by the Baroness Scotland of Asthal that the bill be now read a second time; after debate, the motion was agreed to and the bill was committed to a Committee of the Whole House.
26.Charities Bill [HL]—The bill was reported from the Grand Committee with amendments; it was ordered that the bill be printed as amended. (HL Bill 49)

The House was adjourned at two minutes past nine o’clock
till tomorrow, half-past two o’clock.


DIVISIONS

CONSTITUTIONAL REFORM BILL [HL]

Division No. 1

It was moved by the Lord Kingsland, as an amendment to the motion that this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendment 1B, to leave out “agree” and insert “disagree”; which being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the House divided:

Contents..............191

Not-Contents..............203

CONTENTS

Ackner, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Ampthill, L.
Anelay of St Johns, B.
Arran, E.
Astor of Hever, L.
Attlee, E.
Baker of Dorking, L.
Ballyedmond, L.
Blackwell, L.
Blaker, L.
Bledisloe, V.
Boston of Faversham, L.
Bowness, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Bridges, L.
Brightman, L.
Brooke of Sutton Mandeville, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Buscombe, B.
Byford, B.
Cameron of Dillington, L.
Cameron of Lochbroom, L.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Carlisle of Bucklow, L.
Carrington, L.
Chadlington, L.
Chalker of Wallasey, B.
Chilver, L.
Chorley, L.
Cobbold, L.
Condon, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L. [Teller]
Courtown, E.
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Crawford and Balcarres, E.
Crickhowell, L.
Cuckney, L.
Cumberlege, B.
Darcy de Knayth, B.
De Mauley, L.
Dearing, L.
Denham, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Donaldson of Lymington, L.
Dundee, E.
Eccles of Moulton, B.
Eden of Winton, L.
Elles, B.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Erroll, E.
Ferrers, E.
Flather, B.
Fookes, B.
Forsyth of Drumlean, L.
Fowler, L.
Freeman, L.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Geddes, L.
Gilmour of Craigmillar, L.
Glentoran, L.
Goff of Chieveley, L.
Goschen, V.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greenway, L.
Hanham, B.
Hanningfield, L.

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Harris of Peckham, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Henley, L.
Hodgson of Astley Abbotts, L.
Hogg, B.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Howard of Rising, L.
Howe, E.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Howe of Idlicote, B.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Hylton, L.
Inglewood, L.
James of Holland Park, B.
Jellicoe, E.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Jopling, L.
Kalms, L.
Kimball, L.
King of Bridgwater, L.
Kingsland, L.
Kirkham, L.
Laing of Dunphail, L.
Lane of Horsell, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Lawson of Blaby, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, E.
Lloyd of Berwick, L.
London, Bp.
Lucas, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
MacGregor of Pulham Market, L.
Mackay of Clashfern, L.
MacLaurin of Knebworth, L.
Maginnis of Drumglass, L.
Mancroft, L.
Mar, C.
Marlesford, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Miller of Hendon, B.
Monro of Langholm, L.
Monson, L.
Montrose, D.
Moore of Wolvercote, L.
Morris of Bolton, B.
Moser, L.
Mowbray and Stourton, L.
Moynihan, L.
Murton of Lindisfarne, L.
Naseby, L.
Neill of Bladen, L.
Newton of Braintree, L.
Noakes, B.
Northbourne, L.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Norton of Louth, L.
O’Cathain, B.
O’Neill of Bengarve, B.
Onslow, E.
Oppenheim-Barnes, B.
Palmer, L.
Palumbo, L.
Patten, L.
Peel, E.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Peyton of Yeovil, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Platt of Writtle, B.
Plumb, L.
Prior, L.
Quinton, L.
Quirk, L.
Rawlings, B.
Reay, L.
Rees, L.
Rees-Mogg, L.
Renton, L.
Renton of Mount Harry, L.
Roberts of Conwy, L.
Rotherwick, L.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
Saatchi, L.
Sainsbury of Preston Candover, L.
St John of Fawsley, L.
Saltoun of Abernethy, Ly.
Sandwich, E.
Seccombe, B. [Teller]
Selborne, E.
Sharples, B.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Slim, V.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Stewartby, L.
Strathclyde, L.
Swinfen, L.
Tanlaw, L.
Taylor of Warwick, L.
Tebbit, L.
Thatcher, B.
Thomas of Swynnerton, L.
Tombs, L.
Trefgarne, L.
Trumpington, B.
Tugendhat, L.
Waddington, L.
Wade of Chorlton, L.
Walpole, L.
Warnock, B.
Wedderburn of Charlton, L.
Wilcox, B.
Williamson of Horton, L.
Wilson of Tillyorn, L.
Windlesham, L.
Wolfson, L.

NOT-CONTENTS

Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alliance, L.
Amos, B. (Lord President)
Andrews, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Ashton of Upholland, B.
Avebury, L.
Bach, L.
Barker, B.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Bhatia, L.
Bhattacharyya, L.
Billingham, B.
Blood, B.
Bonham-Carter of Yarnbury, B.
Boothroyd, B.
Borrie, L.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Campbell-Savours, L.
Carter, L.
Chandos, V.
Christopher, L.
Clark of Windermere, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Cohen of Pimlico, B.
Corbett of Castle Vale, L.
Crawley, B.
David, B.
Davies of Coity, L.
Davies of Oldham, L. [Teller]
Dean of Thornton-le-Fylde, B.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dixon, L.
Drayson, L.
Dubs, L.
Dykes, L.
Elder, L.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L. (Lord Chancellor)
Falkender, B.
Falkner of Margravine, B.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Fearn, L.
Filkin, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Garden, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Giddens, L.
Golding, B.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Goudie, B.
Gould of Brookwood, L.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Greengross, B.
Gregson, L.
Griffiths of Burry Port, L.

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Grocott, L. [Teller]
Hamwee, B.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Harrison, L.
Hart of Chilton, L.
Haskel, L.
Haworth, L.
Hayman, B.
Henig, B.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hogg of Cumbernauld, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Holme of Cheltenham, L.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
Jones, L.
Jordan, L.
Kennedy of The Shaws, B.
King of West Bromwich, L.
Kirkhill, L.
Laming, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Leitch, L.
Lester of Herne Hill, L.
Lipsey, L.
Livsey of Talgarth, L.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
Ludford, B.
McDonagh, B.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
McIntosh of Hudnall, B.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
McKenzie of Luton, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
Maclennan of Rogart, L.
McNally, L.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Maxton, L.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Morgan, L.
Morgan of Drefelin, B.
Morgan of Huyton, B.
Morris of Aberavon, L.
Morris of Manchester, L.
Murphy, B.
Neuberger, B.
Newby, L.
Northover, B.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
Parekh, L.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Pendry, L.
Peston, L.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Ponsonby of Shulbrede, L.
Prosser, B.
Prys-Davies, L.
Puttnam, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Razzall, L.
Rea, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Richard, L.
Richardson of Calow, B.
Roberts of Llandudno, L.
Robertson of Port Ellen, L.
Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Rooker, L.
Roper, L.
Rosser, L.
Rowlands, L.
Royall of Blaisdon, B.
Russell-Johnston, L.
Sawyer, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Sewel, L.
Sharman, L.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Smith of Clifton, L.
Smith of Gilmorehill, B.
Snape, L.
Stoddart of Swindon, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strabolgi, L.
Symons of Vernham Dean, B.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Temple-Morris, L.
Thomas of Gresford, L.
Thomas of Macclesfield, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B.
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Thornton, B.
Tope, L.
Tordoff, L.
Triesman, L.
Truscott, L.
Tunnicliffe, L.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Varley, L.
Wall of New Barnet, B.
Wallace of Saltaire, L.
Walmsley, B.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Watson of Richmond, L.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Crosby, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Norwood Green, L.

Division No. 2

It was moved by the Lord Lloyd of Berwick, as an amendment to the motion that this House do agree with the Commons in their amendment 1C, to leave out “agree” and insert “disagree”; which being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the House divided:

Contents..............189

Not-Contents..............201

CONTENTS

Ackner, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Ampthill, L.
Anelay of St Johns, B.
Arran, E.
Astor of Hever, L.
Attlee, E.
Baker of Dorking, L.
Ballyedmond, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Biffen, L.
Blaker, L.
Bledisloe, V.
Boston of Faversham, L.
Bowness, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Bridges, L.
Brightman, L.
Brooke of Sutton Mandeville, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Buscombe, B.
Byford, B.
Cameron of Lochbroom, L.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Carlisle of Bucklow, L.
Carrington, L.
Chadlington, L.
Chalker of Wallasey, B.
Chilver, L.
Chorley, L.
Cobbold, L.
Condon, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L.
Courtown, E.
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Crawford and Balcarres, E.
Crickhowell, L.
Cuckney, L.

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Cumberlege, B.
Darcy de Knayth, B.
De Mauley, L.
Dearing, L.
Denham, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Donaldson of Lymington, L.
Dundee, E.
Eccles of Moulton, B.
Eden of Winton, L.
Elles, B.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Erroll, E.
Ferrers, E.
Flather, B.
Fookes, B.
Forsyth of Drumlean, L.
Fowler, L.
Freeman, L.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Geddes, L.
Gilmour of Craigmillar, L.
Glentoran, L.
Goff of Chieveley, L.
Goschen, V.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greenway, L.
Hanham, B.
Hanningfield, L.
Harris of Peckham, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Henley, L.
Hodgson of Astley Abbotts, L.
Hogg, B.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Howard of Rising, L.
Howe, E.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Howe of Idlicote, B.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Hylton, L.
Inglewood, L.
James of Holland Park, B.
Jellicoe, E.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Jopling, L.
Kalms, L.
Kimball, L.
King of Bridgwater, L.
Kingsland, L.
Kirkham, L.
Laing of Dunphail, L.
Lane of Horsell, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Lawson of Blaby, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, E.
Lloyd of Berwick, L. [Teller]
Lucas, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
MacGregor of Pulham Market, L.
Mackay of Clashfern, L.
MacLaurin of Knebworth, L.
Maginnis of Drumglass, L.
Mar, C.
Marlesford, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Miller of Hendon, B.
Monro of Langholm, L.
Monson, L.
Montrose, D.
Moore of Wolvercote, L.
Morris of Bolton, B.
Moser, L.
Mowbray and Stourton, L.
Moynihan, L.
Murton of Lindisfarne, L.
Naseby, L.
Neill of Bladen, L.
Newton of Braintree, L.
Noakes, B.
Northbourne, L.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Norton of Louth, L.
O’Cathain, B.
O’Neill of Bengarve, B.
Onslow, E.
Oppenheim-Barnes, B.
Palmer, L.
Palumbo, L.
Patten, L.
Peel, E.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Peyton of Yeovil, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Platt of Writtle, B.
Plumb, L.
Prior, L.
Quinton, L.
Quirk, L.
Rawlings, B.
Reay, L.
Rees, L.
Rees-Mogg, L.
Renton, L.
Renton of Mount Harry, L.
Roberts of Conwy, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Rotherwick, L.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
Saatchi, L.
Sainsbury of Preston Candover, L.
St. John of Bletso, L.
St John of Fawsley, L.
Saltoun of Abernethy, Ly.
Sandwich, E.
Seccombe, B. [Teller]
Selborne, E.
Sharples, B.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Slim, V.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Stewartby, L.
Strathclyde, L.
Swinfen, L.
Taylor of Warwick, L.
Tebbit, L.
Thatcher, B.
Thomas of Swynnerton, L.
Tombs, L.
Trefgarne, L.
Trumpington, B.
Tugendhat, L.
Waddington, L.
Wade of Chorlton, L.
Walpole, L.
Warnock, B.
Wedderburn of Charlton, L.
Wilcox, B.
Wilson of Tillyorn, L.
Windlesham, L.
Wolfson, L.

NOT-CONTENTS

Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alliance, L.
Amos, B. (Lord President)
Andrews, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Ashton of Upholland, B.
Avebury, L.
Bach, L.
Barker, B.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Bhattacharyya, L.
Billingham, B.
Blood, B.
Bonham-Carter of Yarnbury, B.
Boothroyd, B.
Borrie, L.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Cameron of Dillington, L.
Campbell-Savours, L.
Carter, L.
Chandos, V.
Christopher, L.
Clark of Windermere, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Cohen of Pimlico, B.
Corbett of Castle Vale, L.
Crawley, B.
David, B.
Davies of Coity, L.
Davies of Oldham, L. [Teller]
Dean of Thornton-le-Fylde, B.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dixon, L.
Drayson, L.
Dubs, L.
Dykes, L.

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Elder, L.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L. (Lord Chancellor)
Falkland, V.
Falkner of Margravine, B.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Fearn, L.
Filkin, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Garden, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Giddens, L.
Golding, B.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Goudie, B.
Gould of Brookwood, L.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Greengross, B.
Gregson, L.
Griffiths of Burry Port, L.
Grocott, L. [Teller]
Hamwee, B.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Harrison, L.
Hart of Chilton, L.
Haskel, L.
Haworth, L.
Hayman, B.
Henig, B.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hogg of Cumbernauld, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
Jones, L.
Jordan, L.
Kennedy of The Shaws, B.
King of West Bromwich, L.
Kirkhill, L.
Laming, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Leitch, L.
Lester of Herne Hill, L.
Lipsey, L.
Livsey of Talgarth, L.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
Ludford, B.
McDonagh, B.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
McIntosh of Hudnall, B.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
McKenzie of Luton, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
Maclennan of Rogart, L.
McNally, L.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Maxton, L.
Merlyn-Rees, L.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Morgan, L.
Morgan of Drefelin, B.
Morgan of Huyton, B.
Morris of Aberavon, L.
Morris of Manchester, L.
Murphy, B.
Neuberger, B.
Newby, L.
Northover, B.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
Parekh, L.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Pendry, L.
Peston, L.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Ponsonby of Shulbrede, L.
Prosser, B.
Prys-Davies, L.
Puttnam, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Razzall, L.
Rea, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Rennard, L.
Richard, L.
Richardson of Calow, B.
Roberts of Llandudno, L.
Robertson of Port Ellen, L.
Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Rooker, L.
Roper, L.
Rosser, L.
Rowlands, L.
Royall of Blaisdon, B.
Russell-Johnston, L.
Sandberg, L.
Sawyer, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Sewel, L.
Sharman, L.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Smith of Clifton, L.
Smith of Gilmorehill, B.
Snape, L.
Stoddart of Swindon, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strabolgi, L.
Symons of Vernham Dean, B.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Temple-Morris, L.
Thomas of Macclesfield, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B.
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Thornton, B.
Tope, L.
Tordoff, L.
Triesman, L.
Truscott, L.
Tunnicliffe, L.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Varley, L.
Wall of New Barnet, B.
Wallace of Saltaire, L.
Walmsley, B.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Watson of Invergowrie, L.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Norwood Green, L.


APPENDIX

PROCEEDINGS OF THE GRAND COMMITTEE (IN THE MOSES ROOM)

The Committee met at half-past three o’clock.

Charities Bill [HL]—The bill was further considered in the Grand Committee; amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; amendments were agreed to; it was ordered that the bill be reported with amendments.

The Committee was adjourned at twenty-five minutes before eight o’clock.