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Baroness Ashton of Upholland: My Lords, if we felt that a person would become an international agent who would develop an even bigger network, we would have to consider that very carefully with other nations when thinking about deportation. Where possible, it is always our objective to prosecute people whom we think are a danger. But as the noble Lord will know perfectly well, that is not always possible. So we look for the available alternatives. There are a very few people whom in these circumstances it may be better to deport to another country as that would disrupt their activities here, where we genuinely believe with good cause that they would not be in the business of doing the same disruption in another country. My brief states that there is "a very small number", but it is a number none the less.
As I have already indicated, the job of the Government is to try to balance all of the significant risks with their obligations in the international arena. That is what this seeks to do. I do not believe that I will convince the noble Lord, Lord Avebury, on this, but he has given me the benefit of several conversations with him, for which I am grateful. I am absolutely convinced that this clause should remain in the Bill. On that basis, I hope that the noble Lord will withdraw his amendment.
Lord Dholakia: My Lords, I moved the amendment. I thank the Minister for her response.
Baroness Ashton of Upholland: My Lords, it just felt as though the noble Lord, Lord Avebury, moved it.
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Lord Dholakia: My Lords, there is a lot of difference between the two of us.
I am grateful to the Minister for her explanation. She knows that since day one of the Bill our views on this matter have differed. She knows also the stance my party takes on issues regarding torture. All Members on these Benches are aware of the fact that when some asylum seekers have been deported, a certain number have never been located again. We do not know what happened to them. I would much prefer to trust in the justice system of this country than to rely on reports from Algeria, Libya and other countries like those.
Our differences remain. For that reason, I intend to seek the opinion of the House.
On Question, Whether the said amendment (No. 11) shall be agreed to?
Their Lordships divided: Contents, 59; Not-Contents, 156.
Clause 11 [Continuation of leave]:
Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendments Nos. 12 and 13:
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"(2) In subsection (2)(b) (continuation pending possible appeal) after "could be brought" insert ", while the appellant is in the United Kingdom,".
(2A) In subsection (2)(c) (continuation pending actual appeal) after "against that decision" insert ", brought while the appellant is in the United Kingdom,"."
Page 6, line 19, at end insert
"(4) After section 3C insert
"3D CONTINUATION OF LEAVE FOLLOWING REVOCATION
(1) This section applies if a person's leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom
(a) is varied with the result that he has no leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom, or
(b) is revoked.
(2) The person's leave is extended by virtue of this section during any period when
(a) an appeal under section 82(1) of the Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002 could be brought, while the person is in the United Kingdom, against the variation or revocation (ignoring any possibility of an appeal out of time with permission), or
(b) an appeal under that section against the variation or revocation, brought while the appellant is in the United Kingdom, is pending (within the meaning of section 104 of that Act).
(3) A person's leave as extended by virtue of this section shall lapse if he leaves the United Kingdom.
(4) A person may not make an application for variation of his leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom while that leave is extended by virtue of this section."
(5) Section 82(3) of the Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002 (c. 41) (variation and revocation: extension of leave pending appeal) shall cease to have effect."
On Question, amendments agreed to.
Clause 13 [Over-staying leave pending appeal]:
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