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Resolved in the negative, and amendment disagreed to accordingly.

9.31 pm

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendment No. 317:

Before Clause 108 , insert the following new Clause—

“Reporting requirements relating to Part 5

(1) The Board’s annual report must deal with how, in the Board’s opinion, the activities of licensing authorities and licensed bodies have affected the regulatory objectives.

(2) This section does not apply to an annual report for a financial year before the first financial year in which a licence is issued under this Part.

(3) In this section “annual report” and “financial year” have the same meaning as in section 6.”

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Clause 108 [Interpretation of Part 5]:

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendments Nos. 318 and 319:

Clause 108 , page 58, line 28, leave out from “not” to end of line 31 and insert “within subsection (2);”

Clause 108 , page 58, line 37, at end insert—

“(2) The following persons are within this subsection—

(a) an authorised person in relation to an activity which constitutes a reserved legal activity, (b) a registered foreign lawyer (within the meaning of section 89 of the Courts and Legal Services Act 1990 (c. 41)),

18 Apr 2007 : Column 317

(c) a person entitled to pursue professional activities under a professional title to which the Directive applies in a state to which the Directive applies (other than the title of barrister or solicitor in England and Wales), (d) a body which provides professional services such as are provided by persons within paragraph (a) or lawyers of other jurisdictions, and all the managers of which and all the persons with an interest in shares in which— (i) are within paragraphs (a) to (c), or (ii) are within this paragraph by virtue of sub-paragraph (i).

(3) In subsection (2)(c) “the Directive” means Directive 98/5/EC of the European Parliament and the Council, to facilitate practice of the profession of lawyer on a permanent basis in a Member State other than that in which the qualification was obtained.”

On Question, amendments agreed to.

[Amendment No. 320 not moved.]

Schedule 15 [The Office for Legal Complaints]:

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendment No. 321:

Schedule 15 , page 212, line 13, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Lord Kingsland moved Amendment No. 322:

Schedule 15 , page 212, line 16, leave out sub-paragraph (2)

The noble Lord said: My Lords, I shall speak to Amendment No. 325 as well. Both amendments address the relationship between the Lord Chancellor and the Office for Legal Complaints. They were debated at some length on 21 February, as reported at columns 1088 to 1094 of Hansard. Your Lordships will be relieved to hear that I have no intention of rehearsing the arguments advanced at that time. I will simply summarise our submissions on the matter.

Amendment No. 322 would take away from the noble and learned Lord the Lord Chancellor the power to alter the number of members of the Office for Legal Complaints. We do not agree with the Minister’s analysis in Committee when she said:

“The Secretary of State ... is best placed to do that”.—[Official Report, 21 February 2007; col. 1090.]

This function should really be undertaken by the board. The Office for Legal Complaints is directly answerable to the board, not to the noble and learned Lord.

The vote on Monday, protecting the independence of the board, adds a great deal of weight to my case. It should be an independent board that takes administrative decisions over the Office for Legal Complaints. I agree with the analysis in Committee of my noble and learned friend Lord Lyell of Markyate that the principle raised by Amendment No. 325, which relates to the removal of the chairman of the Office for Legal Complaints, is, if anything, the more fundamental of the two in this group.

Both amendments would reduce the Lord Chancellor’s inappropriate influence over the Office for Legal Complaints in the Bill. As I indicated in Committee, if the noble and learned Lord the Lord Chancellor were to disagree with the Legal Services

18 Apr 2007 : Column 318

Board on either the chairmanship or the number of members of the Office for Legal Complaints, it would be appropriate for him to take up the issue with the board, not to have the power to act on his own behalf. I beg to move.

Baroness Ashton of Upholland My Lords, I am concerned that the amendments stem from a worry that the Lord Chancellor would have undue influence over the Office for Legal Complaints and I genuinely do not believe that that is the case. The role of the Lord Chancellor in setting the size of the board or in consenting to the removal of the chairman of the OLC is non-interventionist. He will not change the size of the OLC of his own volition nor can he remove the chairman of the OLC. The OLC is a non-departmental body and as such is ultimately accountable to Parliament. It therefore must be right that the Lord Chancellor have the minimum of involvement in how the OLC is constituted. But when I say “minimum”, I mean exactly that. The Lord Chancellor has no role in approving any of the rules that the OLC makes in setting out how complaints can be handled, with only one exception: the rules on case-handling fees. He certainly has no role in appointing ombudsmen to determine complaints or in handling individual complaints. Therefore, any concern that he would have undue influence over the OLC is not substantiated. I hope that the noble Lord will withdraw the amendment.

Lord Kingsland: My Lords, I am most grateful to the Minister. I am quite sure that the noble and learned Lord would not exercise his discretionary power in a prejudicial way. My concern is about the structure of the relationship between the board and the OLC. The OLC is subject to the board’s jurisdiction. The right person to take decisions about the size of the OLC and its composition is surely the Legal Services Board, not the noble and learned Lord. That is the purpose of these amendments. I have listened very carefully to the Minister's reply; there is no meeting of minds on this matter therefore I wish to ask the opinion of the House.

9.37 pm

On Question, Whether the said amendment (No. 322) shall be agreed to?

Their Lordships divided: Contents, 33; Not-Contents, 40.

Division No. 5

CONTENTS
Addington, L.
Ashdown of Norton-sub-Hamdon, L.
Bonham-Carter of Yarnbury, B.
Bottomley of Nettlestone, B.
Bridgeman, V. [Teller]
Burnett, L.
Butler-Sloss, B.
Carlile of Berriew, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L. [Teller]
Craigavon, V.
Cumberlege, B.
Elton, L.
Finlay of Llandaff, B.
Fowler, L.
Greenway, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Inglewood, L.
Kingsland, L.
Linklater of Butterstone, B.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Marlesford, L.


18 Apr 2007 : Column 319

Masham of Ilton, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Miller of Hendon, B.
Monson, L.
Northbrook, L.
Norton of Louth, L.
Razzall, L.
Slynn of Hadley, L.
Tyler, L.
York, Abp.

NOT CONTENTS
Ashton of Upholland, B.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Bilston, L.
Birt, L.
Boyd of Duncansby, L.
Broers, L.
Corbett of Castle Vale, L.
Crawley, B.
Davies of Oldham, L. [Teller]
Drayson, L.
Elder, L.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L. [Lord Chancellor.]
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Foulkes of Cumnock, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Grocott, L. [Teller]
Hart of Chilton, L.
Henig, B.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Howarth of Newport, L.
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jones of Whitchurch, B.
McKenzie of Luton, L.
Mar, C.
Maxton, L.
Moonie, L.
Morgan of Drefelin, B.
Morgan of Huyton, B.
O'Neill of Clackmannan, L.
Pendry, L.
Rooker, L.
Rosser, L.
Royall of Blaisdon, B.
Sewel, L.
Simon, V.
Snape, L.
Tunnicliffe, L.
Young of Old Scone, B.

Resolved in the negative, and amendment disagreed to accordingly.

9.47 pm

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendments Nos. 323 and 324:

Schedule 15 , page 212, line 16, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

Schedule 15 , page 214, line 2, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

On Question, amendments agreed to.

[Amendment No. 325 not moved.]

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendments Nos. 326 to 330:

Schedule 15 , page 216, line 5, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

Schedule 15 , page 216, line 15, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

Schedule 15 , page 216, line 22, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

Schedule 15 , page 216, line 34, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

Schedule 15 , page 216, line 39, leave out paragraph (b) and insert—

“(b) give a copy of the Comptroller and Auditor General’s report to the Lord Chancellor.

18 Apr 2007 : Column 320

(5A) In respect of each financial year, the Lord Chancellor must lay before Parliament a document consisting of—

(a) a copy of the statement of accounts for that year, and (b) a copy of the Comptroller and Auditor General’s report on that statement.”

On Question, amendments agreed to.

Clause 113 [General obligations]:

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendment No. 331:

Clause 113 , page 60, line 31, leave out from “schemes,” to end of line 32

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Clause 115 [Annual report]:

Baroness Ashton of Upholland moved Amendments Nos. 332 and 333:

Clause 115 , page 61, line 12, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

Clause 115 , page 61, line 13, leave out “Secretary of State” and insert “Lord Chancellor”

On Question, amendments agreed to.

Lord Evans of Temple Guiting: My Lords, I beg to move that further consideration on Report be now adjourned.

Moved accordingly, and, on Question, Motion agreed to.

Climate Change Bill: Joint Committee

A message was brought from the Commons that they concur with the Lords message of 27 March that it is expedient that a Joint Committee of Lords and Commons be appointed to consider and report on the draft Climate Change Bill presented to both Houses on 13 March 2007, that the Committee should report on the draft Bill by 13 July 2007 and that they have ordered:

That a Select Committee of 12 Members be appointed to join with the committee appointed by the Lords to consider the draft Climate Change Bill;

That the committee shall have power:

(i) to send for persons, papers and records;

(ii) to sit notwithstanding any adjournment of the House;

(iii) to report from time to time;

(iv) to appoint specialist advisers; and

(v) to adjourn from place to place within the United Kingdom.

House adjourned at 9.49 pm.

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