Examination of Witnesses (Questions 10300
- 10319)
10300. LORD SNAPE: Which is very busy!
(Mr Berryman) It is a very busy line! The idea is not to
jump into the swimming pool with lead weights tied round their
legs until they have learnt how to swim. They are going to try
the system progressively in more complicated areas and I do not
think it will happen at Slough unless it has been demonstrated
that it really does work. I think it is worth just saying a few
words about how the modelling works. A lot of the causes of delay
in the model are due to perturbations caused by other aspects
of the railway, so trains with which Crossrail trains interact
make a big difference to the lateness which is experienced by
Crossrail trains. Network Rail are improving already very significantly
their performance, but it is the Great Western that is the problem
and they are significantly improving the Great Western at the
moment and they are achieving much higher figures than those which
were used when the model was being prepared. As you probably know,
all of their high-speed trains have been refurbished, they have
got rid of some of their less reliable suburban stock, they have
improved their maintenance standards and there are many further
improvements to come on that line. We are confident that, with
improved rolling stock, improved maintenance standards and better
train planning, we can achieve the kinds of numbers that we are
talking about, and the Office of the Rail Regulator has accepted
that that is a reasonable statement.
10301. LORD BERKELEY: Mr Berryman, thank
you very much. That is all I have to question you on.
Examined by THE
COMMITTEE
10302. LORD SNAPE: You did say in reply
to one of Lord Berkeley's questions, Mr Berryman, that some works
were required or will be required to meet, I presume you meant,
the 92 per cent PPM to which you referred.
(Mr Berryman) Yes.
10303. Would those works which you see as being
essential be included? If we take Acton as happening and Heathrow
as a given, would those essential works to which you have referred
include any or all of the four on the list?
(Mr Berryman) Yes, my expectation, my Lord, is that, if the
traffic flows remain as they are and everything else remains as
it is, those four would be required and we would need to do them.
10304. So I am tempted to ask then, why are
we having this debate? If you need these to be done anyway, why
does the Promoter not—and I see Mr Elvin stirring uneasily
here!
(Mr Berryman) Our issue is purely the need to retain flexibility
to make sure that we do not get committed to doing something which,
in the event, proves to be not necessary. We will have to do substantial
works on the existing railway lines to achieve the standard of
reliability and the throughput that we want to achieve. I do not
want anybody to be in any doubt about that.
10305. Do you see, in those works, the four
outstanding ones of the six we are referring to this afternoon?
(Mr Berryman) As things stand today, I would say those four
would be certainly on the list, together with Maidenhead and a
couple of other rather smaller works that are needed.
10306. LORD BROOKE OF ALVERTHORPE: My
note was all these plus some others.
(Mr Berryman) Yes, I would imagine so, my Lord.
10307. MR ELVIN: Your Lordships are doing
my re-examination for me!
10308. LORD SNAPE: Well, we are just
worried about your line of re-examination, you see, and that is
why we are establishing ours first!
10309. LORD BROOKE OF ALVERTHORPE: Just
on the timetabling now of contracts to be let in 2009—
(Mr Berryman) Well, as you are aware, the process of letting
contracts with the EU Rules and so on is quite a protracted job
these days and it will probably take us over a year to actually
let contracts.
10310. You will have to provide a mass of detail
to Europe and so on in inviting tenders. When will you be putting
that information into the process for people to consider whether
they want to bid because it sounds to me as if the amount of flexibility
left for you on this is fairly small?
(Mr Berryman) The first two, they are called OJEU notices,
which are for the first tenders, have already gone out, my Lord,
and we are actually calling tenders for the first two packages
of works.
10311. This is in advance of Her Majesty?
(Mr Berryman) Well, my Lord, the process is rather protracted,
as I said, and there is no question of letting a contract before
Royal Assent.
10312. But it is under way?
(Mr Berryman) So what we are doing is pre-qualifying contractors
at the moment which is a slightly different issue from letting
the contracts, but I am just making the point that the process
has already started in some respects and that will gather pace
in the year after we get Royal Assent. Certainly for the large
works, like the Heathrow access, the time is not long and we will
need either to come to a conclusion one way or the other with
BAA Limited and be clear what we are doing.
10313. Surely within the next 12 months, is
it?
(Mr Berryman) As far as that particular one is concerned,
yes.
10314. And the others?
(Mr Berryman) The others, for example, the Chadwell Heath
loop, we probably would not need to make a decision for four or
five years, but certainly the Acton dive-under and the Heathrow
access we would have to decide pretty soon.
Re-examined by MR
ELVIN
10315. MR ELVIN: Well, your Lordships
have done my first three questions, but, Mr Berryman, I was going
to ask you the same question which is just to get some idea for
how much flexibility we actually want. You have made it clear
that the Acton dive-under, well, that is committed anyway, and
the Heathrow access will have to resolve itself within the next
year or so?
(Mr Berryman) That
is right, yes.
10316. With regard to the others, the timescale,
you think, is in the order of three to four years? Is that right?
(Mr Berryman) Yes, it is. Hanwell Bridge sidings has got
complicated staged works, so that may be the next one to need
to be fixed. West Drayton and West Ealing—there will be
advantages in doing West Ealing early because we could stop the
trains going into Paddington now and that would help our possession
strategy.
10317. We might wait until we get Royal Assent,
Mr Berryman!
(Mr Berryman) Yes, sorry, my Lords, I keep forgetting!
10318. We can do the procurement process without
letting the contracts, but we cannot let the contracts without
the procurement process. Is that right?
(Mr Berryman) That is correct.
10319. Can I then just ask this question: in
order to achieve the 92 per cent PPM, that assumes in the modelling
at the moment most of the Bill works, though not absolutely every
one?
(Mr Berryman) Yes, that is correct.
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