Examination of Witnesses (Questions 320-341)
Ms Monika Kapturska,Ms Anna Wasowicz, Ms Izabela
Gorczyca and Ms Marta Lorens
6 MARCH 2008
Q320 Chairman: Yes, you are, are
you not?
Ms Kapturska: In Poland we have just 16 regions
but they are quite big. We are the second biggest one and, as
I said, we compare with Ireland and we say we are as big as Belgium
in the sense of area. Here you have our administration, which
I would like to show you. The Marshal, which is the president
of the region, implements the Structural Funds with the Regional
Board. Wielkopolska has 54 per cent of the EU average GDP.
Q321 Lord Kerr of Kinlochard: What
is Poland as a whole?
Ms Kapturska: Fifty. We are third after the
Mazowia and Silesia regions. Mazowia has 57 as far as I know.
I will tell you about some tasks and activities of the Wielkopolska
Office. You know what our regional officers do in Brussels.
Q322 Chairman: You have three of
you.
Ms Kapturska: I just wanted to tell you we have
got three employees and we stay in the same building with the
German Hessen, Italian Emilia-Romagna and French Aquitaine. We
have three main areas of activity. They are promotion, funds and
co-operation with the other institutions and regions. We participate
in conferences, seminars and so on. We inform our region about
possible funds and the opportunities. We organise the study visits
of the Commission in our region and the visits of our representatives
here in Brussels. We co-operate with our Permanent Representative
and in the sense of cultural and economic promotion with the embassy
in Brussels. We monitor all the funds and inform our local authorities
of any possible funds and projects. We promote our economy. We
have got a member in the Committee of the Regions, which is the
Marshal of the region.
Q323 Chairman: If I may ask a general
question as you go through. We notice, as it were, that you are
here, not in Poland.
Ms Kapturska: Yes, for five years.
Q324 Chairman: Do you find it very
important to be in Brussels and, if so, why?
Ms Kapturska: Yes. As you know, there are 268
regions and 264 of them have their offices in Brussels, which
means something.
Q325 Chairman: It must.
Ms Kapturska: All Polish regions, except Swietokrzyskie,
have their offices in Brussels. When we compare with the German
or Spanish offices, they have something like 15 people in their
offices so they can share the competences. It is quite difficult
for us, but the important thing is we are here, we can promote
our region here and we try to build consortia for projects and
try to attract our communities and local authorities to co-operate
with the other authorities in Europe to exchange knowledge and
best practices, which is very helpful for us.
Q326 Chairman: Thank you.
Ms Kapturska: As my colleague said, we have
internships in our Office which is very helpful for the local
authorities because people in the region have to know what we
are doing and how they can use this knowledge. It is still not
enough for us so we try to attract people to Brussels. On one
of the last slides you will see our last very interesting project,
the Brussels Club of Wielkopolska. We created this a few months
ago and our colleagues from other regions have been very surprised
that we have had this idea. Because there are just the three of
us we wanted to co-operate with all the people from our region
who work in the European institutions in Brussels. We have found
out there are more than 70 people working in the European institutions
from Wielkopolska. We meet and they can help us in our work here.
I want to go to my colleague, Anna Wasowicz, who will give you
a short speech about the Structural Funds.
Ms Wasowicz: My Lords, given the limited timeframe
I will present you with an outline on Structural Funds in the
Wielkopolska region. This will be an overview of structural assistance
that we have received in past years. I am glad that my colleague
presented you with the details on the new Financial Perspective
in Poland in her region of Lubelskie Voivodship. Our presentation
is a bit different and it should give you the historical approach
to structural assistance accessible to Poland. Let me start with
Pre-Accession Funds that our region received in the framework
of three main programmes starting from 1996. Wielkopolska could
participate in the Phare programme, which is Poland and Hungary
Assistance for Reconstructing of their Economies. This was a major
programme for Central and Eastern Europe, initially established
only for Poland and Hungary but later extended to ten candidate
countries, as I am sure you know. In 1996 Wielkopolska became
eligible to use the cross-border co-operation component within
the Phare programme. Since our region is perceived as doing well
Wielkopolska cannot participate fully in all editions of these
programmes, they were directed mainly to poorer regions and that
refers to the economic and social cohesion component. We were
also able to participate in the instrument for structural policies
for pre-accession that was a Cohesion Fund for implementing the
project. We managed to implement four very successful projects.
We also participated in a special accession programme for agriculture
and rural development. I would now like to give you some main
effects of the implementation of the pre-accession funds in Wielkopolska.
We need to consider that not all of them have been measured since
the last projects terminated as of 2006. We can observe the effect
of Phare assistance to the region but within these limited resources
we managed to implement the very spectacular project of building
a bypass of Poznan, the capital city of Wielkopolska, gaining
co-financing of over €160 million within three years. That
was a multi-annual project. More effective was ISPA financing,
financially important environmental projects and improving access
to drinking water to approximately 20 per cent of Wielkopolska's
population. Support under the SAPARD programme was also effective
in our voivodship with significant and effective support mainly
for food processing and marketing of agri-products. Thanks to
the successful utilisation of pre-accession funds Wielkopolska
is listed in sixth position in the ranking of pre-accession aid
utilisation. Let me present very briefly the architecture of Structural
Funds distributed in Poland in 2004-06. The Community Support
Framework for Poland amounted to nearly €12 billion in the
period 2004-06 and is being implemented through five mono-funded
sectoral operational programmes and one multi-funded Integrated
Regional Operational Programme where nearly 40 per cent of resources
are allocated. We are implementing Cohesion Fund projections and
Community initiatives, INTERREG and EQUAL. The Integrated Regional
Operational Programme is of main significance for Polish regions.
It was prepared by the Ministry of Economy, Labour and Social
Policy but in close co-operation with regional self-governments.
Goals, priorities and measures cover the whole of the country
but most regions differ in their implementation, it depends on
the socio-economic structure and situation in the voivodships.
This Perspective has been managed nationally by the Ministry of
Regional Development since 2005 but most tasks are performed in
the regions by regional self-government, Marshal Offices, which
are responsible for project identification, and regional state
administration, which are Voivodship Offices, which are responsible
for audit, monitoring, payment verification and certification.
Q327 Chairman: I am sorry, I need
to move you on a little. Could you take us quickly through what
you are looking to do in 2007-13?
Ms Wasowicz: As you can see,—
Q328 Chairman: I see, for instance,
that you are hoping to spend a lot of money on communications
and infrastructure.
Ms Wasowicz: Yes, that is correct. These are
priorities set out by the regional government which is now responsible
for programming and implementing the Structural Funds.
Q329 Lord Kerr of Kinlochard: Can
I ask what "implementing" means there? If I am an entrepreneur
and I want to establish a factory, may I apply to the Structural
Funds or do I have to be a public sector body wanting to build
a road or an airport?
Ms Wasowicz: Private sector entities are also
definitely eligible to obtain co-financing with the priority competitiveness
of enterprises, yes.
Q330 Lord Kerr of Kinlochard: What
proportion of these numbers do you think would be private sector?
What would be the public sector/private sector breakdown?
Ms Wasowicz: In the Regional Operational Programme
it is also an obligation imposed by the European Commission to
design the financial architecture, so I would encourage you to
have an in-depth look at the programme which is on the CD. I do
not recall at the moment.
Q331 Chairman: Do not worry.
Ms Wasowicz: I am sure the significant amount
will be contributed by the private sector here.
Ms Kapturska: There is a joint instrument for
the private sector and enterprises, the JEREMIE instrument.
Ms Wasowicz: €60 million will be implemented
under the JEREMIE instrument in our voivodship.
Ms Kapturska: Which is exactly for private enterprise,
SMEs.
Q332 Lord Kerr of Kinlochard: But,
of course, they can also go to a bank or to the European Bank
for Reconstruction and Development or to the European Investment
Bank or a private sector bank. I used to think when I knew a bit
about it that people who had a very good project, private sector
people, would not bother about this sort of money because this
takes a lot of paperwork, a lot of approvals, they would go to
a bank and get a loan if they were confident they were going to
make money and pay off the loan quickly. Is that the case, that
the private sector complains that the paperwork and delays and
complications are a disincentive to going for Structural Funding?
Ms Wasowicz: There are very convenient preconditions
to obtain these loans in the framework of the JEREMIE instrument
and probably most of these companies would never obtain an equal
amount from a regular bank.
Ms Kapturska: As far as we know, they co-operate
very well with the Agency of Regional Development which deals
with this fund for enterprises.
Q333 Chairman: Thank you. I am afraid
we are running out of time.
Ms Wasowicz: I am truly sorry, since we have
also prepared a list of key projects.
Q334 Chairman: I was going to say
that while we are running out of time I would be very glad to
put these into evidence. One can see from the paper what sort
of thing it is, what you are doing and how you are using the money.
We will also extract material from the CD. Clearly we will come
back and talk to you in a year or so and find out how it is all
going. We are very grateful to you for your help. You have provided
us with a great deal of evidence which is here and which we can
take home and include in the report.
Ms Kapturska: I am sorry for our lack of knowledge.
Normally we do not deal with the Structural Funds.
Q335 Chairman: You have given us
a great deal of information.
Ms Kapturska: We have great experts in our regions.
Q336 Chairman: You have given us
a great deal of information, which no doubt you had to drag out
of your regions, and we are most grateful.
Ms Kapturska: We will send some more information
if you need it and we can co-operate with our colleagues in the
regions.
Lord Trimble: If you send us anything further,
what we would particularly appreciate is your view of how easy
DG Regio is to work with, whether you think they are too controlling
in terms of what you want to do or whether you find you can do
the things you want to do within the programme that they have
laid out. A consumer's perspective of how the Commission operates.
Chairman: We know how the Commission thinks
it operates, we would like to know what the consumers think, and
so would they. They would like to know if they are making difficulties
for you.
Q337 Lord Trimble: And we will not
tell them who complained!
Ms Wasowicz: Being the biggest beneficiary of
Structural Funds we cannot really complain.
Q338 Lord Kerr of Kinlochard: Oh
yes you can.
Ms Kapturska: We have got our Commissioner.
Q339 Chairman: Yes, of course you
have.
Ms Kapturska: Mrs Hübner.
Q340 Chairman: Who we are seeing
later.
Ms Kapturska: The fact she is the Commissioner
for Regional Policy is wonderful for us. I can say in the name
of Wielkopolska that we have wonderful contact with Mr Beschel
from DG Regio. He is the head of the unit for Poland. He is in
our region very often and supporting us in implementing JEREMIE
and JESSICA. Maybe your Committee would be interested to come
to Wielkopolska and have such a visit.
Q341 Chairman: What a nice idea.
Ms Kapturska: It could be a great opportunity
for us and the people who are dealing with the Structural Funds
to present you with much more information and knowledge.
Ms Lorens: The evidence.
Chairman: For the purpose of this report we
feel well-served. Thank you all.
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