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I will now raise yet again the issue of the large number of regulation-making powers in the Bill for the Secretary of State. I am afraid that you will hear a great deal more from me on the subject as the Bill progresses. It is fundamentally an unsatisfactory way to make laws. The powers tend to be wide-ranging and non-specific to make sure that every future possibility is catered for, but that is completely unclear about what is intended in the first place. This clause is no exception. What precisely is meant by,
That is very wide-ranging. Might it include, for instance, limiting the number of candidates put forward for interview, which follows on from the issues discussed on Clause 2 about the role of the senior appointments panel? I am also not clear whether the new paragraph on payments to senior officers is designed to mandate or prevent large golden handshakes being doled out to failing senior officers who depart prematurely. I had a lot of experience of that over the years when I was chairing my own police authority.
I understand that one key driver for the provision was a concern on the part of ACPO that chief officers were not always fully consulted by police authorities before the authorities made appointments at deputy or assistant chief constable rank. However, I understand from the Association of Police Authorities that protocols governing the topic have now been agreed between it and ACPO in principle, which looks like a good move. I do not see any reason to regulate on the subject at all if the main reason that drove the inclusion of the clause has been removed. It remains the job of the police authority, not the Home Secretary, to appoint chief officers and to determine the pay and conditions on which they are appointed. Regulation-making powers of this nature look like an attempt to erode and blur this important line and they are to be greatly resisted.
Lord West of Spithead: Clause 3 allows the Secretary of State to make regulations which will support the work of the senior appointments panel—the subject
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The key theme for the policing Green Paper is greater local accountability. Enabling police authorities to act in the best interest of the force to ensure it has the right leadership to enable it to deliver for the public is critical. The new chief officer appointments framework increases the focus on the performance of chief officers. However, the Government recognise that there could be circumstances when there is a need to change the individual, as I discussed before, and Clause 3 allows police authorities to exercise their discretion in agreeing the appropriate compensation.
Additional functions would relate to the appointment of senior officers and would be conferred by the Secretary of State, following consultation with a panel. These may be required so that the work of the panel can evolve to best meet the needs of the tripartite. I do not believe this gives too much power to the Secretary of State. It is necessary to have order-making powers to confer additional functions on the panel. We are creating a more flexible structure and allowing further consultation with stakeholders. Before conferring additional functions, the Secretary of State must consult the panel—so the Secretary of State is not acting in an autocratic way—giving all the panel members, both independent and tripartite, an opportunity for a full discussion. Parliamentary committees looked at all the orders laid before the House, providing an additional check, so there are checks and balances.
The Deputy Chairman of Committees: Before calling Amendment 13, I must advise the Committee that if it is agreed to, I cannot call Amendments 14 to 16 inclusive due to pre-emption.
Clause 4 : Metropolitan police force appointments
13: Clause 4, page 4, leave out lines 16 to 40 and insert—
““(2) Any appointment of an Assistant Commissioner shall be made by the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis, subject to regulations under section 50.
(2A) Before appointing an Assistant Commissioner the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis shall—
(a) consult the Metropolitan Police Authority, and
(b) obtain the approval of the Secretary of State.”
(3) In section 9FA (Deputy Assistant Commissioners of Police of the Metropolis) for subsection (2) substitute—
“(2) Any appointment of a Deputy Assistant Commissioner shall be made by the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis, subject to regulations under section 50.
(2A) Before appointing a Deputy Assistant Commissioner the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis shall—
(a) consult the Metropolitan Police Authority, and
(b) obtain the approval of the Secretary of State.”
(4) In section 9G (Commanders in the metropolitan police force) for subsection (2) substitute—
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“(2) Any appointment of a Commander in the metropolitan police force shall be made by the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis, subject to regulations under section 50.
(2A) Before appointing a Commander in the metropolitan police force the Commissioner of the Police of the Metropolis shall—
(a) consult the Metropolitan Police Authority, and
(b) obtain the approval of the Secretary of State.””
Lord Imbert: I begin with an apology. I was unable to be present in your Lordships’ House for Second Reading and, thereby, to make early comment on Clause 4 and give notice of my intention to table an amendment. I know convention does not demand that I give reasons for that omission, but as a matter of courtesy and good practice, I shall do so. Only a few days ago, I returned from a course of post-stroke therapy, which has kept me from attendance in your Lordships’ House, but I hope that it will now enhance my involvement, enabling me to speak without juxtaposing words and to stand before you more steadily.
I have tabled this amendment with the full knowledge and support of the Metropolitan Police Commissioner. It accords with his wishes and reflects his fears for the future accountability of the commissioner and my fears for the further politicising of policing. This amendment applies only to London, our capital city, since it already has an elected mayor and regional government. I declare an interest and past involvement as a former chief constable of a large provincial constabulary, and as a former Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis. Yes, I am the archetypal yesterday’s man or, perhaps more correctly, the day-before-yesterday’s man. None the less, this gives me some insight into the present system of selections. Having observed how the office of Metropolitan Police Commissioner has, in the last few years, been buffeted backwards and forwards in a party-political cauldron, I firmly believe it is time to take policing out of politics and to take politics—as far as possible political influence and most definitely political direction—out of policing.
I repeat my emphasis that my amendment refers only to our capital city. The arrangements for appointing the commissioner and deputy commissioner should, however, remain unchanged because of their national responsibilities. Similarly, the arrangements for selecting chief officers in other parts of the country would remain as envisaged in the Bill.
Since the creation of the post of Mayor of London and the amendment to the Greater London Authority Act, which enables him to chair the police authority, there is enhanced accountability for the commissioner in London, with potentially significant consequences. If that accountability almost by osmosis turns into increased direction and operational control by political appointees, we will have moved a significant step towards a system obtaining under totalitarian regimes where the reigning political power has operational control and direction of policing. Freedom to demonstrate peacefully has long been cherished in this country and authority to march or hold a protest meeting should be given only on public order grounds and without political consideration.
I have a short anecdote. A number of years ago I was considered to be a leading police figure in the fight against terrorism and in the art of negotiation. I
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Policing is too important to be left solely in the hands of politicians or indeed solely in the hands of the police. We must find a way to get the right balance for the benefit of the public we serve. Will we one day see a future mayor with an office on the upper floors of New Scotland Yard? I return to my main theme. If the mayor as chair of the authority can hold the commissioner and his or her top team to account, it is only right that the commissioner should have the power to appoint that top team. I understand that the outgoing Home Secretary, the mayor, the chair of the Metropolitan Police Authority and the deputy mayor for policing have acknowledged the good sense of the commissioner’s suggestion that this should be the way forward.
This is about leadership. The leader of an organisation like the Metropolitan Police with a staff of more than 30,000 personnel must have a vision of how to improve policing of the metropolis for the benefit of all law-abiding residents and for those who work in, visit or pass through this great city. He or she must articulate that vision, obtain public acceptance and then, together with loyal disciples, put it into practice. If those who are to turn the vision into reality are selected by anyone other than the commissioner, they may, because of influence from elsewhere, be going down a different path.
5.30 pm
I re-emphasise that I do not advocate any change in the Bill relating to the selection of senior personnel in other than the Metropolitan Police. From my experience there is a much more transparent and—dare I say?—civilised approach, to such matters elsewhere. In my time as chief constable of Thames Valley Police, the selection board comprised the non-political chairman of the police authority and two members from each of the major political parties. As chief constable, the merits of the various candidates were discussed with me. Although the selection was rightly carried out by those members of the police authority, they would not have selected someone to whom I was opposed or have gone against my advice—an altogether civilised approach to get the best, most suitable candidate for the job.
London, however, is a different kettle of fish. I reiterate that since the creation of the post of Mayor of London and the amendment to the Greater London Authority Act, which enables him to chair the Metropolitan Police Authority, there is enhanced accountability in London with potentially significant
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If the chairman of Thames Valley Police Authority, when I was chief constable, had said that he would no longer give me his support in running the force, I would have known which way he was pointing. I commend the amendment as a way of reducing the risk of party politics becoming unnecessarily involved in or influencing policing in our capital city.
Lord Harris of Haringey: I declare an interest as a member of the Metropolitan Police Authority and former chair of that authority. I have enormous respect for the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, whose views on most matters to do with policing I listen to with great interest, and I usually agree profoundly with what he says.
On this occasion, however, I disagree profoundly with what he says. I think that he has misunderstood the current situation in London and the position of some of the key players. First, the amendment is a retrograde step, which goes against the philosophy and changes proposed in the Bill. It goes against the spirit of giving more control and say to local communities in the running of the police service, and it goes against ways of opening up the police service to the influence of the local community.
I was distressed to hear the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, say that the amendment was proposed with the full knowledge and support of the present Commissioner of Police for the Metropolis. I have no reason to doubt that that is the case, but if so, it is a serious breach of faith between him and the police authority in London. This matter has not been discussed with the Metropolitan Police authority. It may have been the subject of private discussions with the Mayor of London and the deputy Mayor of London with responsibility for policing, but they have not expressed the views of the Metropolitan Police Authority. Were the amendment to be carried, it would increase rather than diminish the risk of politicisation of policing decisions in London. We would create a situation in which the commissioner was more likely to be set against the views and wishes of the police authority than one where the commissioner was working with the authority.
In my time, I have chaired appointments panels for a large number of commanders, deputy assistant commissioners and assistant commissioners of the Metropolitan Police. I have participated in a number of such appointment panels subsequently. In all of those the commissioner has been an important adviser. As I understand the Bill, that position would be strengthened to give the commissioner the power essentially to veto. I think that it would be a veto if a commissioner said that he was not happy with a particular candidate. The proposal suggested by the noble Lord, Lord Imbert—
Lord Clinton-Davis: Is the noble Lord saying that we ought to have more time for discussion with the police authority on this matter?
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Lord Harris of Haringey: I am suggesting that we should not support the amendment and that the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, might want to think again and talk more widely about it. The arrangements in the Bill provide all the safeguards that the commissioner needs to have the sort of management team and people that he wants, but at the same time it makes clear the relevance and importance of public accountability of other senior officers. An assistant commissioner of the Metropolitan Police is the equivalent of a chief constable outside London. Under this Bill, assistant chief constables and deputy chief constables will be clearly appointed by the police authority. This amendment would make London different. The result is likely to create more of a gulf between the commissioner and the police authority to which the person is accountable.
In practice, if you are to carry the public of London with the difficult policing decisions that need to be taken, it is important that they, through the police authority, have confidence in those holding significant office. The arrangements that have been put in place will set up confidence rather than diminish it. The amendment would be a retrograde step and I hope that when responding, my noble friend will say that the Government also think that it is a retrograde step. As I say, I have the most enormous respect for the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, on most policing matters, but I hope that he will recognise that perhaps this is not a sensible way forward.
Baroness Henig: I understand where the amendment is coming from. It has elements to which I am sympathetic but I must oppose it in this form for reasons that I shall outline.
I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, that party politics have absolutely no place in policing. I am sure that we all agree on that. I understand the concerns lying behind the amendment and the worry of a commissioner, or any chief constable who has to be judged by the team around them. They fear that while others choose the team, they will be judged on the team’s performance, which could lead to problems. The fear is misplaced because appointments tend to be made by the chief and the police authority working closely together. It is rare for it not to work that way, but I understand the fear.
As my noble friend said, outside London police chiefs are locally accountable to their authorities. I think that the same principle should apply in London. For those elements of policing that are relevant to London the commissioner has to be accountable to the Metropolitan Police Authority. I accept that there may be national functions for which the commissioner has direct responsibility to the Secretary of State. That is where policing in London differs because it has that twin element to it. For me, political proportionality is absolutely key. No police authority should be dominated by a political party one way or another. The biggest change that I have witnessed in policing since the 1990s is that many people who have worked with police authorities in the past 10 to 15 years have worked to make policing and police authorities non-party-political. To make the Association of Police Authorities an all-party-respected national body is crucial to this discussion. If I felt for a minute that the
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My worry is not for now but for the future; in this amendment, we see the dark shadow of the future. If we go down the road of direct election to police authorities—if we go down the road of elected commissioners—this issue about the politicisation of policing will come back to this House. That is why I am so vehemently opposed to some of the proposals I have heard. Police authorities and policing have to be above politics. That is a crucial principle, with which I am sure we would all agree.
Lord Borrie: It is a pleasure to see and hear the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, once again in this Chamber—and in good voice. We heard everything he had to say, and while colleagues who have spoken so far may not have agreed with him, he has made his case clearly. I have no doubt the Minister will be glad that the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, has spoken in the way he has, with his long experience in police forces, not only as head of the Metropolitan Police, but also, of course, outside London.
I find this an extremely difficult issue. In favour of the argument of the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, is the point that the Commissioner wants the very senior police commissioners and assistant commissioners around him on a day-to-day basis to work together as a coherent, harmonious team. That is in the interest of the running of the police force and, of course, in the public of London. On the other hand, there are the points that my noble colleagues have already made; one wants in the team surrounding the Metropolitan Commissioner—assistant commissioners and commander—people who are independently minded and who have their own views; people who will contribute, sometimes strongly, and perhaps to the irritation of the Commissioner, their views. It is important that the group surrounding the Commissioner is independently minded. It is also most important to avoid the risk, and the reality, of cronyism, which can come from appointments all being made at the top level by the Commissioner himself.
I find this extremely difficult. Because it is so difficult, I hope that the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, will consider the matter—especially in the light of comments that were made by colleagues earlier in the debate; perhaps he will consider withdrawing the amendment. Ultimately, the accountability to the police authority is probably what should count in the creation not only of the Commissioner himself but of the most senior deputies and assistants who surround him; they are the equivalent, as one of my noble colleagues said, of a “chief constable elsewhere”, and therefore ought, perhaps, to be appointed by the authority itself.
Lord West of Spithead: A number of noble Lords have already mentioned this, but I think the whole House welcomes the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, back again. He is in fine form, having completed whatever course it was; the noble Lord’s charming wife has been the regimental sergeant-major who has driven him down this route, and I have been filled with admiration for that as well.
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I would like to thank the noble Lord for raising the important issue of the senior appointment arrangements in the Metropolitan Police Service. As he knows, Clause 4 of the Bill already corrects an anomaly. Previously, the Commissioner had no formal voice in the appointment of officers at the rank of assistant commissioner, deputy assistant commissioner and commander. We have ensured that there is a formal role now for consultation.
The noble Lord is not alone in making the case to go further. The Metropolitan Police is unique in the scale of its operations and in the national functions that it carries. Under current arrangements this has meant that the MPA has to appoint a far larger number of senior officers than in any other force in this country. The Government are sympathetic to the view that this may not reflect the best balance of police authority oversight and leadership of the organisation by the Commissioner. After all, it would seem entirely reasonable for the most senior and accountable member of an organisation as large and with such wide-reaching functions as the Met to be able to have a full role in appointing his or her own senior staff.
5.45 pm
I take the point made by my noble friend Lord Borrie about the importance of having independence among one’s subordinates, but it is always a question of balance. I would not have liked, on a ship of mine, a second in command who tried to run a totally different ship from the one I wanted. However, were such a change to be made, I am of the view that there should be a balancing change to the legislation concerning the removal of senior officers at the ranks that the Commissioner took responsibility for. It would be unusual to lead on the appointment of a senior team and then not even to be consulted were removal to be considered. Indeed not having this role may not be the best basis for generating confidence in those seeking appointment, and therefore potentially undermine such appointments at a very basic level.
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