Examination of Witnesses (Questions 1600
- 1619)
1600. LORD YOUNG OF NORWOOD GREEN: Just
before you move off this, I think we might as well clear this
point. I understand exactly the point you are making in relation
to those deep-level tunnel areas and the interchange points with
London Underground, but is there any way that the station design
could be altered so that people could not transfer bikes? Has
that been looked at?
(Mr Berryman) That would be counterproductive
to the main aim of the railway which is specifically to allow
free transfer between various lines so that the system works more
efficiently and so on. It is hard to think of any way of putting
up a barrier to stop bicycles which does not also stop PRM passengers,
or even parents with buggies or whatever.
1601. BARONESS FOOKES: The basic infrastructure,
that is the narrowness of the actual Tube size and so on, there
is no way that is going to be altered, is there?
(Mr Berryman) No.
1602. They are immutable?
(Mr Berryman) They are immutable I fear, yes.
1603. MS LIEVEN: Merseyrail, Mr Berryman,
can you explain in this respect what the key difference between
Crossrail and Merseyrail is?
(Mr Berryman) Merseyrail operates what I think is called
a courtesy policy in the peak, so they try and discourage passengers
from carrying bicycles, but at other times they are allowed and
they are allowed in the underground section. The first thing to
say is Merseyrail is very much less busy than the London network
generally is. All the trains and all the platforms there are full-sized
trains, they are not Tube trains, so there is no question of bicycle
users taking their bicycle from a large-sized train into an unsuitable
train, that just does not happen on Merseyrail because there is
no Tube network.
1604. Thank you. I am going to leave the other
international examples at this stage and move on to cycle parking
issues. Can we put up our Exhibit 3, please, which shows the cycle
parking.[16]
First of all, is it right to say, as I said in opening, that the
only two stations where there is no provision planned at the current
time for cycle parking are Tottenham Court Road and Bond Street?
(Mr Berryman) That is correct.
1605. Mr Holladay made lots of reference to
lots of things that might happen in terms of the Mayor's encouragement
of more cycling, things like secured cycle parking, free bicycle
provision within Central London, issues such as that. To what
degree in your view is it appropriate that Crossrail through the
Crossrail Bill should be taking steps in respect of those kinds
of initiatives?
(Mr Berryman) Those initiatives are other
parts of the transport policy for London overall which is set
by the Mayor and Transport for London. Of course, whilst we welcome
anything which improves the journey quality of our passengers,
it is not our place to restructure the whole of the transport
provision for this kind of thing through the whole of London.
Things like the bicycle hiring system and so on is a mayoral initiative
and something which is more appropriately done by the Mayor rather
than by this project.
1606. Where it has been possible to do so, such
as at Farringdon and Whitechapel, to what degree has Crossrail
worked with the local authorities to ensure bicycle parking?
(Mr Berryman) Most local authorities in
the UK encourage the use of cycles now, and I think all the local
authorities involved with Crossrail do. The London Boroughs of
Camden and Tower Hamlets, which are the two boroughs primarily
involved there, but also the City of Corporation, are all very
keen to ensure that parking facilities are provided.
1607. MS LIEVEN: I think that may be
a little hard on the London Borough of Islington actually because
it is Islington that is responsible for Farringdon.
(Mr Berryman) I had forgotten that. Yes, you are quite right.
The problem is ameliorated to some extent there by the fact that
certain streets are going to be closed and pedestrianised and
that creates space for reasonable and good quality bicycle parking.
For example, at Whitechapel, when your Lordships went to visit
it we walked through the back of the station, if you remember,
into a large open area. That will be pedestrianised and it is
expected that bicycle parking will be provided there. It is outside
our limits, it is not something that we are acquiring land to
do, but it is something we will do jointly with the local authority
in the area. On all of these examples that is the case.
1608. Take Farringdon as an example, Mr Holladay
made the point that often infrastructure planning, what is called
retrofitting, so coming along later and adding something in, can
be very problematic and expensive but if, for instance, at Farringdon
he was right to say that with the advent of Thameslink 2000 lots
and lots of people were getting from Farringdon to St Pancras
and it was convenient for them to leave their bike at Farringdon,
how easy will it be after Crossrail opens, or maybe before it
but not now, to provide extra bicycle parking on Cowcross Street
outside Farringdon Station?
(Mr Berryman) That would be relatively easy because Cowcross
Street is a street which runs outside Farringdon Station between
Farringdon Road and the back of the station and that will be pedestrianised.
There is quite a lot of space there. It would be easy to add additional
facilities later on if such a need was demonstrated.
1609. MS LIEVEN: The last point on cycle
parking, Mr Holladay—
1610. CHAIRMAN: But not at Bond Street?
(Mr Berryman) I am afraid at Bond Street and Tottenham Court
Road it is not really possible to identify any space where such
a facility could be provided. The area, as you will know, is very
congested and there are no big spaces where we are closing roads
or anything like that where such a provision could be provided.
1611. LORD YOUNG OF NORWOOD GREEN: Are
you saying that you have done the same sort of in-depth analysis
of the possibilities in conjunction with the local authority at
Bond Street and Tottenham Court Road as you have with the others?
Whilst I understand that you cannot be expected to solve all these
problems and there are joint responsibilities, nevertheless we
talk about an integrated transport system and we have got an opportunity
here to do as much as we possibly can to make that concept a reality.
What I want to ensure is that you have diligently explored every
possibility with the local authority for the reason Mr Holladay
gave, which is designing something in or trying to anticipate,
is a damn sight easier, if you will pardon the vernacular, than
it is trying to retrospectively deal with the situation.
(Mr Berryman)
As far as the stations themselves are concerned, we have explored
with the local authorities that there are no road closures associated
with those and there is no space where significant bicycle parking
could be established. However, as I think was explained in opening,
there are also what we call over-site development opportunities
at all of these stations and we are currently exploring with in
particular Westminster whether some of those over-site development
opportunities may themselves result in street closures. I have
to say that is something that is completely outside the scope
of this Bill, it is something which is associated with the developments
above the station. If that eventuates, and negotiations with authorities
on these matters are not always easy, then there may be a possibility
of doing something at that stage.
1612. CHAIRMAN: Yes, it is going to be
a matter for the local planning authority, is it not?
(Mr Berryman)
Indeed.
1613. MS LIEVEN: Take Bond Street as
an example, and I have to say because it is one I know well, if
Westminster in future years decided to extend pedestrianisation
into Davies Street or South Moulton Street and they wanted to
provide bicycle parking there, is that something that would be
within their control?
(Mr Berryman) It is.
1614. One other thing on cycle parking just
because Mr Holladay mentioned it. There was mention of the secure
bicycle facility that has now been provided at Finsbury Park.
Could you just explain the differences between that and what could
or could not be done at Bond Street or Tottenham Court Road?
(Mr Berryman) Yes. As it happens, just by coincidence, when
I was a director of the SRA I was very peripherally involved in
the provision of that facility. My recollection is it was on,
if you like, a freestanding building constructed on a separate
site some 50 or so yards away from the station. It is an excellent
facility. It has got undercover parking for bicycles on racks
and everything, it has got a bicycle repairman downstairs and
I think it has even possibly got bicycle hiring. The point about
it is it was on a site that was available and part of a comprehensive
re-jigging in particular of the bus station which was being considered
at the time, although I am not sure if it was ever actually done.
The thing that made it feasible was the fact that there was land
available and a suitable site could be found. That is obviously
much easier at a site which in a relatively less built up part
than, say, Bond Street or Tottenham Court Road.
1615. BARONESS FOOKES: I just want to
pursue the point made by Lord Young on this question of the division
of responsibility, shall we call it. We fully take it that you
do not have certain responsibilities about which the cyclists
are anxious, but one can take what one might call a sort of passive
attitude and wait for the local authorities to come to you or
you can take the active side and say, "How can we discuss
this with you at this stage?" Which is it?
(Mr Berryman) My Lady, I would not like to say anything unkind
about local authorities but I am afraid bitter experience tells
us that if you take the passive attitude then quite often something
does not happen. We try to take a fairly proactive attitude as
far as we can.
1616. That was what I was hoping you might say.
I presume there is no reason either, of course, why quite independently
of Crossrail and all its works the cycling club should not pursue
these points with individual stations, but that is for them.
(Mr Berryman) I believe that they are
a very active lobbying organisation and do pursue local authorities
on these matters on a regular basis.
1617. LORD JAMES OF BLACKHEATH: In the
quest for open space around the Bond Street area there is one
pedestrianised street that I am aware of, which I think is Moulton
Street, is it?
(Mr Berryman) That is correct, yes.
1618. But Moulton Street is not used for cycle
parking at the moment, I think
(Mr Berryman) No, it is not. Moulton Street is a little way
away from our station actually.
1619. Nothing is perfect.
(Mr Berryman) Nothing is perfect. In connection with the
over-site development, or over-station development, we are talking
about possibly pedestrianising part of Weighhouse Street, which
is the street between our station and the West One Shopping Centre.
That may be a more appropriate location.
16 Crossrail Ref: P13, Cycle parking at stations (LINEWD-93_04-006) Back
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